Boot up and operation problems , laptop PC

Discussion in 'PC Hardware' started by Antiwin, Feb 22, 2012.

  1. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    #1 Antiwin, Feb 22, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2012
    Hi ,

    Untill lately, I have had a normal operating Vista home premium PC. I had C and D partitions om my HD. Later I crated a new partition by decreasing C volume, later I installed Vista ultimate to C partition.
    It worked there w/o problem for 3 weeks , then I applied Win 7 loader. It operated a few times but then caused problems. I uninstalled loader , but problems left behind.. Then I decided return to Vista again and used factory made Ghost Vista image ( coming with purchased PC) back. Then apllied service packs and updates. A few days later I observed PC start up problems even during before windows start up. My screen shrinked roughly 1/8 in size and multiple screens seen on the lcd screen , see the link below ..

    Pls note that somewhere in between the above history , I had updated the BIOS from the manufacturer site , İt had worked w/o problem after bios update for days.

    IMG_0601.JPG



    This multiple screens also happen even if I put latest Hiren Boot cd in CD rom and selet the first boot option as CD. It becomes very difficult to read the screen go to try any rescue job.


    What could be the reason of this multiple diveded screen image?

    My PC is Medion MD96684 model sold only with Vista, it has no Win 7 application from the manufacturer.

    Your comments / suggestions and help are wellcome.
     
  2. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

    Feb 13, 2012
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    Reset the BIOS to default ?

    Does the same happen if you plug in an external monitor ?
     
  3. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    Resetting the Bios did not cure. External monitor did not work. We installed a clean Xp now , it then worked correctly. It seems that it is a Nvidia driver problem.
     
  4. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

    Feb 13, 2012
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    You said it happened with Hirens boot CD, thats not a driver problem, windows drivers are not even loaded with Hirens
     
  5. gabris[LT]

    gabris[LT] MDL Senior Member

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    #5 gabris[LT], Feb 25, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2012
    have seen it only once, but I have 2 suggestions:
    1. NVIDIA defect(aka overheating problem).
    2. Seen it when changed LCD on laptop with incompatible one. :) (if this one and LCD wasn't changed - check flex cable and try to reconnect LCD flex(connectors mobo->flex and flex->LCD(clean dust if needed)).
     
  6. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    I tougth that heat problem but I think that is not the cause.. When I start the laptop the day after it is still there. Today I installed Win 7 when the screen is diveded in 8 section. First reload default BIOS values , then I quick formated the C drive , put the win7 DVD in drive and start the PC. It still started in 8 section , I started Win 7 installation and somewhere along the installation , during somewhere restarting by itself , it returned to normal 1 section screen displaying. That means it couldnot be heat or flex cable problem , I think that some device conflicts sets some settings out of control.
     
  7. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

    Feb 13, 2012
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    Its a hardware fault 100% most likely its the GPU as it happens with external monitor too
     
  8. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    Gabris,
    Thanks for your info and link. It points to me bad news .. o_O I have the same Nvidea card 9300M G , I read almost same type of claims in the site with this video card. I will try to contact the Medion here but I do not have much hope for succesful repair.
    What is strange that , this problem happened to seen just a few day after my BIOS update. I had asked the service center before bios update about the changes in the new Bios, and they had told me that they changed the operation of cooling fan etc. without too much detail. Now , with a hope , I will try to find previous bios from the Medion and flash it and see whether it has a relation in timing of bios update and emerging of problem.
     
  9. gabris[LT]

    gabris[LT] MDL Senior Member

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    #10 gabris[LT], Feb 28, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2012
    Seems to be worse news - GPU overheat 80%, because new BIOS changed operation of cooling fan and so on, so they made less rotation speed that it would make less noise = higher temp, so overheat would easily come in few days.
    As technician I can say that this BIOS update you used broke your laptop, and Medion is guilty for this. and thing that's left - you need to prove that they made this, and Medion won't stand a chance. They will give you new laptop. :D I was in Turkey few years ago(as stated in your profile it's your country), better use ATI video chips, they works on high temperature better and are more stable than NVIDIA.
    I have made my theory about these video faults. It's not chip overheat and it's not PCB(Printed Circuit Board) overheat it's soldering iron overheat, by new standards(ROHS) manufacturers should use only lead-free soldering iron, which has less conduction current(used G translate for that, but seems to be right), that produces heat on overload(as every metal), and the GPU's maximal current is about 70W if 3.3v powered it would be ~21A that's a lot! after some time temperature can get high enough to loose contact with PCB/GPU and cause various failures. about GPU chips Nvidia are smaller than ATI chips and they have less temperature dissipation(G translate again), so on NVIDIA chips temperature can get high much faster and cause overheat of soldering iron. about repairing - most popular is reflowing, solution only for some time because lead-free soldering iron made to solder only once, while classical soldering iron can be soldered much more times. So it developed another BGA GPU repair process called re-balling when you need to remove GPU from PCB and remove all soldering iron from GPU and PCB where GPU contacts are and place classical soldering iron, and whola, no more repairing needed for at least few years. Hmm... and why I have took those few beers....
     
  10. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    I beleive that it was caused by bios update , after use of my laptop w/o problem of about 3.5 years , it just happenen after bios update . Service technichian had told me that , there were customers complaints of "fan running unnecessearily :eek:" ... I think that they decreased the fan operation speed and/or operation temperature limit which caused the problem.
    Today I applied the previous Bios but it did not cure .. It points out that defect is irreversible unfortunately. As you know that , there is a statement on manufacturer's page , " update of bios at your own risk , no responsibility is assumed"..

    Do you think that if we resolder it , it could go for another 3-4 years? As I know , BGA packages is problematic in soldering , IR reflow soldering or heating by heat gun is necessary. Do you know that is it possible to remove the BGA Ic , cleanig the pads and then apply classic Pb/Sn cream solder to pads ( difficult part of the repair job, I think ) with good succes ratio ? There should be some special tools so finding a good service center is necessary.
     
  11. gabris[LT]

    gabris[LT] MDL Senior Member

    Nov 6, 2010
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    it needs very good technician, so good service center is necessary, success ratio - depends on hands. yes there is that kind of possibility, but it will cost you much.
     
  12. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    Is there a internal display card driver on mobo(sharing the system mem , same as in desktop PC) on laptops? Is it possible that I detach the flex cable coming from LCD panel and connect it to some proper connector on mobo and use my PC w/o problem? It will degrade the performance but it does not matter for me , I do not play games on laptop.
     
  13. gabris[LT]

    gabris[LT] MDL Senior Member

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    I don't understand what you've said. :)
    You already mentioned that external monitor sometimes works sometimes not.
    you may be asking if your laptop has 2 video cards for example 1x removable NVIDIA and one 1x integrated Intel - check hardware specs for that.
    Or, If video card in that laptop is removable, but then I see no logic in whole sentence. :D
     
  14. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    Forget that , Gabris:). This is my first laptop and I am learning, I tought that the laptop and desktop configuration structures could be same , so I asked that. Sorry for my poor explanation:rolleyes:.

    The idea was that ; In desktop PC , there is a on board VGA connector on mobo, so you can connect your monitor and use yr PC, its performance is not so good and it usually share the main mobo memory. On the other hand, you may connect a external garphics card to one extension slot( non shared memory) and now you connect your monitor here for better performance , therefore you have 2 operating video card in the system ( of course, if you have installed an external graphics card). This is the case in my present desktop PC.

    In my laptop , my video card is stated as " 128MB non shared memory PCI express card ..." or so on specification sheet on the packing. Here I tougth that the defective card is an external card conected to one of extension socket on mobo and hoping :D that there coulde be an internal one on the mobo :eek:.. Life could be so easy if everythig has a spare alternative..

    Later I searched the net and found that I am not the first one asking that kind of inquarie:rolleyes:. Answer is simply "No".
    I will have the laptop reaired at Medion repaire service center , next week or so. Cost is around 120$.
     
  15. gabris[LT]

    gabris[LT] MDL Senior Member

    Nov 6, 2010
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    Some laptops our days have 2 video cards, one integrated(it almost impossible for it to broke, I have seen only once, on desktop mobo) and another should be removable. :) Still haven't seen in practice, but heard in theory. :D
    What kind of repair, reflow or replace? :)
     
  16. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

    Feb 13, 2011
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    The integrated graphics your are talking about is in the Processor, when you plug in the video card the on board processor graphics turns off.
     
  17. Antiwin

    Antiwin MDL Novice

    Feb 17, 2012
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    I have got my defective laptop back. They have replaced the Nvidea chipset ( I've also taken the defective chipset back). Price is around 110 $.
    They modified the bios or laptop a little and now fan is working continouesly , thus preventing GPU heat up too much. It makes some noise and naturally eats up battery more than previous case. I hope it will not repeat the same problem in short time.o_O