Do you care...?

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by gorski, Apr 17, 2012.

  1. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

    Oct 21, 2009
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    ...what you eat/drink[or 'ingest'...:biggrin:]?!?

    Do you inform yourself, as to what is good and what is a bad practice when it comes to your body and its needs? [For there are false needs, as we all know...]

    For instance:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-17731052

    What are your reasons for [not] caring?
     
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  2. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    May 6, 2007
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    I care, but there are also vices.
    I have my own idea what is good for me. (Being Chemist there is some scientific background.) I have my own idea and I often laugh about a so-called nutritionist.
    I can recommend what I think is good for me. But not everyone agrees with my point of view.

    Also I have to say that to inform about is not easy. Questions about the right nutrition are hard to answer, 'experts' have different POV's...some are even abstruse IMHO.

    But I try to care about.

    Some examples.

    -I mainly drink water, sometimes mixed with natural apple juice (made by local manufacturers) I avoid artificial softdrinks with sugar.
    -I like Asian cooking. They use fresh vegetables and many spices.
    -I take care of my weight, I never had too much (so far).

    But: I have a good beer to the meals, or some good wine when I want to.
    Also I smoke rarely.

    Beer and wine have been discussed controversial.
    Many 'scientists' don't agree in opinion, not only alcohol related.

    Some say some red wine is good for health and some say it's harmful.

    IMHO here is one universal rule: Everything will become harmful if consumed frequently.

    Varied nutrition is the best, you basically can 'ingest' everything.:biggrin:
     
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  3. msr

    msr MDL Senior Member

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    #3 msr, Apr 23, 2012
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2012
    I think one of humans reasons for eating is to enjoy it. So that is one of the reasons where food is in abundance like 1st world countries.

    Like losing weight, you can eat just choculate and lose weight. Eating healthy is fine and good but its only really for people that are well off, and you can afford to shop in expensive shops. I am sure food is better in various places, but being poor like most are we cannot really choose.

    For me i do not care one bit about what the op is writing about. Eating is also meant to be enjoyable, not only for survival purposes. We live and one day we die, waste of time starving yourself to be thin, when you should want to be your natural weight.

    One thing i do think on no matter what you eat, getting the process through you is important. Being blocked up can be bad, so that process of excreting is very important, and its something your body needs to do quite well. Most people ignore this.
     
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  4. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    It depends on where you live. There are places where the people are not rich. But they grow their food by themselves. They cultivate vegetables and have own animals.
    To be 'poor' doesn't mean to have to eat unhealthy, the contrary can be true, especially at places where people are dependent on agribusiness.

    I also have experienced that you can get original and healthy and the best food at the countryside. There the price level is low and the quality of the food high, the cuisine original. Simple cuisine mostly means healty cuisine.

    Different is the city. People need to pay there a lot more. And they have a great variety of 'industrial' artificial meals and foods.
     
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  5. msr

    msr MDL Senior Member

    Dec 27, 2007
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    Yen, i understand if your poor in poorer countries you may actually eat healthy. But in most 1st world countries, the poor which are the majority eat really badly. Foods that make them feel good rather being good for them.

    Also people are never educated till too late really on what is healthy unless they have strong willed parents that may force there kids to accept what is right for them. Most people in west today are too lazy to tell there kids, just let them eat junk foods.

    But your right if you live in rural areas or in some poor countries you may eat healthy.
     
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  6. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

    Feb 13, 2011
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    Cheap red wine is very good, the more expensive aged ones are bad. Makes sense in a way the closer you are to the actual fruit the better it is for you.
    It's good for the same reason dark chocolate is good for you, antioxidants and flavonoids! I prefer eating the grapes than drinking the wine.

    I try to follow this list

    I love black tea with no milk or sugar, I drink about a gallon a day.
    Fruits will always be better than cooked food for me especially when the food uses copious amounts of oil.
    And no matter what they say, I don't believe that coffee is good for you in large amounts unlike Vitamin C.
    I like baking fish and I don't usually eat anything other than chicken or pork. I love cooking, learnt since I was 12.
    I love making pot roast chicken, bbq :tasty:or baked Cornish hen :eek:now I'm getting hungry.
     
  7. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    So I think it's rather a matter of education and motivation than a matter of money.
    Their food culture is degenerated. They consume convenience foods, not even aware what's artificial or what's used at all.

    You can buy healthy foods and cook your own meals at home, especially when you are a family you can save a lot of money and cook healthy at once.

    People need to learn again what it means to eat. It's not just an action, it's culture.
    To choose the foods and ingredients, to prepare them, to cook with the family, or friends and finally to enjoy the meal together.
     
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  8. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    It is good to be convinced of something. I am and you are.
    But every opinion, especially concerning which foods are good for one can be doubted.

    I try to explain what I mean:

    How to determine what is good for one and what is not? It is all based on particular studies.
    Foods and fruits are very complex. They consist of thousands of different substances.

    Red wine: It's all in the skin. Scientists have discovered that the skin of the red grapes consist of substances which can be antioxidants.

    But the most attention attracted resveratrol (I know this since I had been involved in research)
    Resveratrol showed impressing results in studies.

    So there is a chain of assumptions:
    Resveratrol showed impressing results (healthy)---->red wine contains resveratrol in the skin of the grapes--->redwine can be positive regarding health.

    But it is one of thousand substances and nobody really knows if the red wine he's bought contains finally resveratrol.
    The longer the skin stays in contact to the mash (wine making process), the more resveratrol can be extracted.

    When used metal barrels to age the wine resveratrol becomes decomposed.
    When used oak barrels, the wine can extract substances from the barrel which protect the resveratrol to become decomposed. Also the red wine extracts substances from the oak which also are antioxidants.


    What I want to make clear: Nobody can judge about if the wine he has bought is useful for the health or not.
    Scientific headlines about a particular substance or group of substances which claim to have discovered a new drug in foods has to be treated with caution.

    It says not much about the food itself.
    You cannot say cheap red wine is better......one even can't say the resveratrol that is found in red wine will have any positive effect in human.

    Also there are results that show that antioxidants prevent harmful processes.
    But to show that foods which contain antioxidants are good for health, that's hard and statisics are mostly not significant.



    Since every opinion can be doubted, I refrain from stating: food x is good for health, because......

    The only thing that remained is the general rule: Everything will become harmful if consumed frequently.
    As consequence to have a great variety of foods is suitable.

    If something will be healthy or harmful depends on the dosage, it depends not on what it is.

    Finally a bit provoking idea:
    Almost everybody says smoking is harmful to health.
    I say this statement is too generic to be right. What about if one cigarette a month would protect you from cancer?

    "Poison is in everything, and no thing is without poison. The dosage makes it either a poison or a remedy"

    ~ Paracelsus :worthy:
     
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  9. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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    #9 R29k, Apr 23, 2012
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2012
    I agree with you Yen especially when they come out with studies that say x food is good and then 10 years later you hear the opposite.
    However I don't see how well know fruits can have negative benefits with proper use. I would recommend eating lots of fruits to anyone!
    I may not know the exact benefits of them but they are surely better than the other garbage available like junk food and soda.
    As I said I like eating the grapes, I don't really like wine. I can tell you however that massive amounts of Vitamin C are very good for you,
    to be more specific your immune system. I would recommend to anyone to eat lots of mangoes and oranges everyday if possible. I don't like using
    medication especially for things like flu and since I have been taking lots of C I find that i rarely get the flu, the last time that happened for me was 5
    years ago. And whenever I get a flu I find that ginger tea or ginger beer does wonders for it, better than any tablet.
    I have never smoked anything in my life other than herring :laie: I used to be asthmatic and I beat that through exercise, walking and running mostly.
    I think a commonsense approach to life in general is to eat lots of fruit and veggies, exercise, drink in moderation and have lots of sex :D
    :rolleyes: Oooh and the #1 rule, stay away from annoying women they will kill you very fast ....
     
  10. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    I agree with you. (sex=movement=burned calories, lol :biggrin:)

    No seriously,
    to have fresh various fruits and vegetables cannot be harmful, especially when you can get them from your own garden (you can exclude that they are full of pesticides). And fresh they taste very good. When I am on my trip through Asia I try local fruits. Some of them even don't have an English name. I am always very impressed how many exotic fruits are used in other countries and how they taste.

    At home I don't have a own garden, but my hobby is to grow different chili plants on my balcony. Last Saturday I moved them to direct sunlight the first time. (They can get sunburn if you aren't careful, no joke.)

    This year I have some from Assam (India) Mexico and central Africa.


    Concerning the first post I want to say another issue is that the food industry often fools the consumers.
    They produce multi vitamin juice and make us believe to have something valuable, something that is good for us.

    Many of them add synthetic vitamins (often more than one needs) and artificial flavors and a huge amount of sugar.
    That's the problem! We think we are doing something good for our health, but in fact we are fooled.
    But there are manufacturers that produce good quality juices. You usually find them not in the supermarket, but in a health food shop.

    Fresh fruits from a known source cannot replace juice from a supermarket, though.
     
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  11. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #11 gorski, Apr 24, 2012
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2012
    (OP)
    I would say that the principle is to be involved, to want to learn, to be pro-active and take care of your own health, not just bodily health!!!

    As I consider myself a modern subject, this is the core of it all: http://watersbroken.wordpress.com/kants-what-is-enlightenment-the-text/

    Re. the poverty and food, even in cities: I was very poor for quite a while, living in London. But I ate and lived pretty healthily...

    For instance, I informed myself about various additives to the food and more: the process of food creation and what is lacking in modern food, so then I added some extra vitamins and minerals to my diet. Cheaper than a beer or chocolate a day, as Linus Pauling used to say! But essential! Read http://www.doctoryourself.com/livelonger.html

    I was unemployed, so no money but plenty of time, which I used to combine the cheap but best I could get for my money - from local markets to special deals in various supermarkets and most of it from Lidl (You remember the famous Tesco jingle: "Every Lidl helps!" :D ). One must spend some time reading the labels, of course, in relation to what you learn about additives and so on. So, the rule of thumb is "no chemistry, only food with face"! :D Seriously, the less ingredients the better...

    I loved sports, too and it showed...

    I went to the docs and checked myself regularly and my bloodwork etc. was exemplary, I was told. I tell you, my mum was full of these stories about macrobiotics etc. - but she always had some kind of health problems, seen in her blood imbalance etc. She would come to London to visit me and I would not allow her to cook... I would also take her out and about aplenty and made her walk... She would go home and check her blood and her results were markedly better than before she came to see me. She would rarely acknowledge anything to anybody but this time she was forced to... :D Made my day! :D

    I would have her have a nice glass of the aforementioned cheap red wine, too... :D I would also join her and never get overboard. It relaxes you - this I would add to the already mentioned stuff, as in the cities, as well as modern life generally, stress is overwhelming way too often and for way too long a period of time, so de-stressing is necessary, provided it's not more than the minimal amount necessary (a glass or two of wine, for instance...).

    So, it's about spending some time informing yourself, then choosing carefully, eating varied food and exercising regularly. The key being "enjoying yourself doing any and all of it"! If it is a burden - there's no happiness there...

    So, in effect, if you are not a cynic and you actually enjoy taking care - there's hope for you...
     
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  12. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

    Oct 21, 2009
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    Ooooooo, yes, doctor!!!!!!!!!!!!:biggrin::D

    Esp. the last bit, certainly!!!:worthy:

    :)
     
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  13. RawData

    RawData MDL Member

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    I take good care... to eat and drink everything, as long as food/drink tastes good and there is enough of it. :p
     
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  14. 60cent

    60cent MDL Senior Member

    May 31, 2011
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    Everything is healthy as long as you take the proper amount,i mean tooooo... many fruits or veggies isn´t healthy either.
    For example i had a neighbour living near me and we often used to run for 4-5 km in the morning and did a lot of activities together he even trained the army and some basketball and handball athletes,he never smoked and always ate 6 meals a day and only bio-food,what happened in the end a few days ago he went running and had a brain attack and died with 45 years.
    So it doesn´t always depend on what people eat or if they smoke a lot,i think it´s the gen and destiny what depends on how long you will live and when you will die.
    Some people smoke,drink and eat junk food all there life and become 90 years old,some never smoke... and die with 30,40 years.

    P.S.YEN your right with your statement Sex=Movement=Burning calories,but only particularly:eek::D,why ,well it´s easy,if you do something than it´s right,but if you put your hands behind your head and let her or maybe him:eek: do all the dirty work and don´t move an inch you won´t burn that much calories and there is no movement,maybe little movement rolling with your eyes:eek:
     
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  15. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    That case would be what is know as anecdotal evidence...
     
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  16. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    There is a joke:

    Wife and husband in the bedroom. They are married for a long time. The wife wants to have sex and takes the initiative....and finally sits on him..

    Husband: "Good night, honey. Just switch off the light when you have finished with it!" :D
     
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  17. half Man Half Biscuit

    half Man Half Biscuit MDL Addicted

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    Oh boy i think i want to marry now too :D
    She is even going to switch off the lights?well better then that it can´t come IMHO hihihi
     
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  18. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Sadly, that's frequently married life for ya...:rolleyes::D

    [:bangin:]
     
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  19. longjourney

    longjourney MDL Novice

    Jun 14, 2012
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    I do care what i eat or drink, but it is hard to judage it's nutrition. Just enjoy the meals.:biggrin:
     
  20. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #20 gorski, Jun 15, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2012
    (OP)
    But that can be a problem, if you are raised on deep fried stuff or lots of sweets loaded with fat, salt and especially sugar, heavily processed industrial food, laced with preservatives, colourants, artificial flavours and whatnot, given the fact we are witnessing more and more cases of those additives being carcinogenic or crazy intense farming and cattle raising instances (BSE being a very good example) and so on and so forth...

    Just look at some of the Western kids being raised on utter nutritional garbage. They have no idea what they are eating. They have no idea what good, quality food is. They would not crave/demand it. There are "good" examples of Westerners going abroad but demanding their "chips and beer" - never mind trying something new, opening up to the world, broadening their horizons etc. As Ernst Bloch said: "Travelling badly is just changing your surroundings!"

    The issue (also) is that of lazy, uncritical attitude towards science and technology and "Prussian mentality" of "trusting the state", corporations and - generally speaking - people in white coats and uniforms, i.e. "benevolent authorities" allegedly knowing better than ourselves what's good for ourselves, without ever knowing us personally or otherwise, who are frequently led by sociopaths (see "Corporation" for instance)...

    In effect, modern Subject is the basis of Modernity - but there are very few truly modern Subjects about. I'd say too few, some may say the numbers are rising - but...

    Who is a really modern Subject? I would broadly say not only professionally but fundamentally (or at least equally) intellectually and morally competent person, taking care of him-/herself, other people and his/her environment!

    See the text/link in my signature, for instance...:cool:

    Therefore, a person judging what's what already is "educated/raised" in a specific manner and most of us are "creatures of habit", judging (and we all invariably judge all the time - we have no other choice but to judge) on the basis of what we know, what we have been shaped on... and that can be a real problem.

    Therefore, "just enjoy your meal" is a really bad idea... Just like telling everybody, including incestuous people, that "loving your parents (or kids or sibblings)" is a normal thing - but what is "normal" for them... oh, well... need I go on? The "content/substance" they will pour into that cup might be totally undrinkable to most of us, if we actually think/talk about it...

    And that is the point of this thread - to think it through and then debate it in a rational manner...

    The utterly emotional "just enjoy things as they are" is really missing the point!

    One of the crucial points of a modern Subject is the right to doubt/be sceptical and therefore critically examine and keep re-examining oneself, one's world, one's role in the world and "just be" or "just enjoy..." leaves things as they are, to my mind - speaking on the level of principles...

    And things as they are are not exactly agreeable to me, sorry... I do not feel this world as "my own", so to speak, "lock, stock and barrel"!

    I would rather think about it, debate it with critically minded people, then take thoughtful action, thanx a bunch...

    And sometimes, on that path, one must challenge one's precepts, one's feelings, one's values...

    Poor quality, badly conceived (with profits in mind!), nutritionally poor food is but an example...
     
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