poettering's latest news........ (yes, more systemd)

Discussion in 'Linux' started by Skaendo, Feb 2, 2015.

  1. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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  2. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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    #2 Skaendo, Feb 5, 2015
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2015
    (OP)
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  3. EFA11

    EFA11 Avatar Guru

    Oct 7, 2010
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    money talks, even in open source. I'm not sure if I would call it a conspiracy though. Perhaps an open willingness to add a hook into everything for certain eyeballs. Either that, or simply cannot conduct a proper conspiracy, in secrecy. Or is it a distraction from something more? Never know, but I do know RHL is too big for Linux -in general- anymore. I love Fedora too, go figure.
     
  4. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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  5. Hotbird64

    Hotbird64 MDL Developer

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    systemd is not the root of all evil

    Freedom is always threatened by large corporations and governments in a way that they want to use publically owned resources like the internet or free software for their very own purpose to control people and we should oppose such threats. However, systemd is rather just a piece of software replacing a 30+ year old technology.

    When I started working with Unix in 1988, there was already an /etc/inittab and the directories /etc/init.d and /etc/rc[0-6,Ss]. While init scripts in /etc/init.d were slightly simpler, /etc/inittab was almost identical to Linux systems today.

    system v init starts services/daemons but does not monitor them, e.g. restarting sshd, if it crashes. This old and unsafe technology urgently needs some replacement. Apple has done this with launchd on Mac OS X and iOS.

    Lennart Poettering probably actually wants to much with systemd. While better versions of an init system and a resource manager (controlling which amount of resources like CPU and memory may be used by users and processes) are really needed, there is actually no need to replace everything (e.g. cron, network-manager, dhcpd, ntpd, syslogd, pam, ...). The systemd people should have focused on what's really needed.

    If you have a look on systemd-timesyncd (replacement for ntpd), systemd-networkd (replacement for network-manager and dhcpd), systemd-timedated (replacement for cron), you'll easily see, that they are not ready to replace current daemons, which still have much more features.

    If you look, what RedHat, Debian and Suse are really using, is systemd itself, systemd-logind, systemd-udevd and systemd-journald. The rest has to yet proove that it is worth replacing older utilities. E.g. even crond is really old, it is a great and simple to use technology to start scheduled jobs. There is no need to replace it. And this won't happen until systemd delivers a service that is far better, simply because of the existing ecosystem for cron.

    If you have a look at the Plan 9 operating system which had better concepts in many respects than Unix, e.g. much better interface to TCP/IP than the Posix socket interface, Plan 9 is basically dead, because the changes were not that revolutionary to give up Posix compatibility and the surrounding ecosystem.

    What I actually mean, there is not enough pressure for people or Linux distributions to give up on daemons like crond, ntpd or dhcpd in favor for a (yet) not even better replacement. This just will not happen.

    Regarding a new init system, there is pressure. Just have a look at my sys v init script for vlmcsd. While I write that in 10 minutes or so, many people who aren't bash scripts wizards, have trouble writing such scripts for other programs. If you also look on the config files for launchd and systemd, they are much simpler and easier to understand for non-programmers. The only file you need for systemd is vlmcsd.service in my example which has only 11 lines.

    So I think everyone should just relax and wait for jessie (debian 8). BTW you can always type apt-get install sysvinit to get rid of systemd. This is actually required in some cases, e.g. if you want to run debian 8 in a container.
     
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  6. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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  7. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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    SIGINT Goals for 2012-2016

    2.1.4 (TS//SI//REL) Influence the global commercial encryption market through commercial relationships, HU MINT, and second and third party partners

    Source: Official NSA SIGINT Strategy 2012-2016 Document
     
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  8. Skaendo

    Skaendo MDL Addicted

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