Seeking opinions re: Windows 10 Pro vs. IoT

Discussion in 'Windows 10' started by ciscokid, Feb 1, 2024.

  1. ciscokid

    ciscokid MDL Senior Member

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    Going to install Windows 10 on a few Windows 11-unsupported PCs. I know Windows 10 Pro has about a year and a half or so left with updates.

    Seeking opinions on whether I should just install Windows 10 IoT LTSC on the machines so I don't have to worry about anything for a few years or install Windows 10 Pro and hope for a workaround to receive updates after November 2025.

    What do you think?
     
  2. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    You need to install LTSB / LTSC because they came with way less crap, not because the updates, which likely won't be a problem (ESUs, workarounds and alike).

    Care about what is better for you *today* and for the foreseeable future, not about a far future that even MS is not sure about it.
     
  3. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    you could use msmg toolkit to clean windows 11 pro, its not difficult at all, plus few registry tweaks and it will work better than 10 on your machines. then you could create bootable install.wim using dism++ for example out of your perfected windows 11 pro and then replace install.wim you created with install.wim on a bootable usb so you can install exact same custom os on as many machines as you want.

    and if you really want windows 10 then go for ltsc 2021 as you will have clean os without tweaking, then in summer Microsoft will release windows 11 ltsc you could replace ltsc 2021 with the new one.
     
  4. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    You seem obsessed by DISM++. Why use it to manage the iso after using MSMG that can build it pushing a couple of keys?

    Also why waste your time to decrap W11 when you can use Server 11/2025 which is cleaner than LTSC out of the box, doesn't have any unsupported HW limit, has defender uninstallable from the GUI and comes with a bunch of (optional) features unavailable on a stock W10/W11?
     
  5. ciscokid

    ciscokid MDL Senior Member

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    Thanks guys, definitely things to consider. I am leaning towards IoT now but Server 2025 would be a perfect alternative, basically Windows 11 without all the TPM/CPU restrictions as far as I can tell. :cool:
     
  6. ciscokid

    ciscokid MDL Senior Member

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    Great points, thanks
     
  7. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    Yes, but TPM/CPU restrictions are the lesser problem (at least for clean installations). The unpatched Win 11 can be installed in any machine(*), if you take 5 minutes to learn to use dism apply-image instead of the old school, time consuming setup.exe.

    (*) any machine = is valid until build 253xx, since 29xxx, Win11/Server 11/2025 is hard locked on very old machines (core2, Turion64, Athlon64...) no matter what you do.
     
  8. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    i guess because its easy to use by an average person, also after tweaking iso with msmg toolkit people like me usually do other tweaks and after everything i just open dism++ and with a 3 clicks make backup or install.wim. simple no ? dism++ is actually a great tool with a tones of tweaks sadly abandoned. i saw over the years some people were attacking devs of dism++ saying its not good maybe malware etc probably because of it was developed by Chinese or something. for me it works and does what i need. to clean sxs and caches two clicks cleaned.
    also why use msmg toolkit if all you need is a PowerShell and dism ?

    two clicks in dism++ install.wim mounted, two clicks unmounted.

    as to Server 11/25 are you talking about for example
    Windows Server, version 23H2 (25398.643) amd64 data center core

    from uup dump ?
     
  9. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    thing with server is that instead bloat in pro you get tones of server tools you will never use. I will wait for that other guy to replay to see what server hes actually talking about but better go for ltsc if you're installing windows just on normal pcs.
     
  10. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    You dont need to learn dism at all to install windows 11 on an unsupported pc. All you need is to open regedit during installation and add few simple entries to bypass tps etc
     
  11. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    Simple but redundant.

    If you're able to use MSMG, supposedly you should be able to move to the ISO creation menu, no need to replace anything just customize, then build your ISO (which is practically useless in 2024)

    So dism++ = simple, msmg= simpler

    Old Server 11 thread (with a title purposely obfuscated by we know who)

    https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/server-ip-ltsc-builds.84158/

    (thanks God) Since 26040 we have the official Server 2025 branding and a related thread (with a sane title) is opened since a couple of days

    https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/discussion-windows-server-2025.88013/
     
  12. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    It's just stupid to install like in the dos days instead of deploying no matter if supported or not.

    Deploying is waaaay better/faster/easier since Win7 days

    Newbies can use winntsetup.exe, just try then (eventually) argue.
     
  13. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    as to dism++ wont argue with you or try to explain to you anything you have your own thinking and you will fight everyone who doesn't agree with you.

    as to server you talked about earlier well if op uses his pcs for office work home work like office or watching movies gaming and similar i surely wouldn't advice him to install server on his pc.
    azure cloud services, remote desktops and such he will never use.

    ltsc is best option for everyone because of its just bloat free windows, but since win11 ltsc wasnt released yet best option is to use windows 11 pro and either debloat it with msmg toolkit or even without or use 11 pro as is if someone likes new or just stick to ltsc 2021 for now.
     
  14. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    not really sure what are you trying to say ?
     
  15. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    It's just more operations. It's a fact not an opinion.

    Dism++ is a nice tool, just use it when needed.

    If you lack practical experience on servers is not my business, again, try the (eventually) argue.

    See above, azure services has little to do with a local server, on the other hand I use RDP (which is in clients since the stone age) for home task every day.

    Controlling a PC/HTPC/Server from your bed using your smartphone can be veeeery handy, (just to mention one of the possible use)

    LTSC is good, Servers are better for almost any scenario (no matter if you're a newbie or the mother of all sysadmins)


    That's the point. Until you spend 5 minutes to try what I'm suggesting, you have no idea of what I'm talking about
     
  16. ciscokid

    ciscokid MDL Senior Member

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    Thanks guys, I really want to stick with Windows 10 on these machines, looks like IoT LTSC 2021 is the best option for now. :D
     
  17. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    #18 acer-5100, Feb 1, 2024
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2024

    That's what experienced users on forums are for. Providing suggestions to less experienced ones. Learning isn't mandatory, so feel free to use a nuclear missile to kill a sparrow.

    Hahaha. Keep watching stupid videos and talking about something you never tested in person.

    hint: people use server OSes on workstations since the days of nt3.51(there are even entire websites about the matter), when Win Server lacked a bunch of things useful for home users (codecs, directx and alike).

    But now we are in 2024....

    Again feel free to learn or to stay ignorant about the matter, but at least avoid to mislead other users.

    First learn, then teach.

    P.S. Perhaps a leaked LTSC 2024 is available since today.

    https://forums.mydigitallife.net/th...e-ltsc-2024-preview.88019/page-2#post-1823761
     
  18. Jingzin

    Jingzin MDL Senior Member

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    you told me something similar once before that youre extremely experienced and people like me are learning from people like you and i dont even know you nor i learned anything from you ever as to experience i think you lack both manners and experience youre the kind of person that loves to brag about how full of knowledge are you. Would bet my house you got no friends in real life.

    as to leaked ltsc its just preview so read it properly
     
  19. acer-5100

    acer-5100 MDL Guru

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    It's just I'm used to open my mouth about what I know, and keep my mouth closed and by ears well opened when I face someone more experienced than me on a definite matter.
    This is the way people become experienced over time.

    I suggest to use the same behavior, then (again) feel free to do what you prefer, but arrogance is never a replacement for experience.

    And so? Are you scared to wet your socks? :D