WIN10 OEM edition inplace nondestructive upgrade (Home-->ENT/EDU) KMS as end result

Discussion in 'Windows 10' started by WyldWolf, Mar 24, 2016.

  1. WyldWolf

    WyldWolf MDL Junior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
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    Okay so first of all I literally have about 100 chrome tabs open and before everyone blasts my head off I truly have read more threads on this than I think any other darn topic in years.

    So I have read every conflicting story of running DISM /online .....etc. and other methods but not one post showing this scenario which has to be one of the most common and without a clear answer. Given how many hacks there are/been to up/down grade editions, edit registry, etc. there HAS to be a way to do this:

    Current:
    Windows 10 OEM/Home/Core digital entitled activation.

    Desired:
    Windows 10 Enterprise VLK/KMS

    1st of all, conflicting indicates I can do this:

    1. HOME--->PRO via key....now can you at this stage use a KMS client key on this OEM laptop to at this stage convert to KMS pro?

    2. I know that HOME--->PRO via standard retail key will change edition but then requires a perm key to activate (or older OS upgrade key)......does not meet requirement of being KMS activated at end state even if settling for pro was an option.

    3. I know that HOME--->ENT via inserting disc will not properly do inplace upgrade without a hack, right? So, is it possible to downgrade via registry like the tools posted here do for 7/8 to lie make current OS look like already ENT and then the inplace upgrade works without data loss? <---This option albeit a PITA and a full install could I guess meet requirement if it resulted in an installed KMS ENT edition with full inplace apps/registry/drivers/etc.

    4. DISM and package based inplace edition upgrades.......many posts make it look either DISM or PPKG can easily convert PRO to ENT but......which PRO? KMS I assume? But I've read this <may> fail if you have the OEM bios keys. Back to top of list.....

    So literally, I just want to take a pre-loaded laptop already (unfortunately) having been used having config and data I don't want to lose and get it to either ENT or EDU via KMS activation and I cannot believe <yet> without having the gurus chime in that I'm not missing something and there really is not a way to up/down/side-grade yourself from HOME to KMS-based ENT/EDU just because MS says it's not supported (since ways were found on the last 2 OS' that also weren't supported by MS).

    Help!?! <I do dev work and quite bit scripting so if it is still even a manual way of accomplishing I would be happy to then put in some time to create some automation methods to share here>
     
  2. Enthousiast

    Enthousiast MDL Tester

    Oct 30, 2009
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    Xinso could help you.

    But what's the benefit of having a pro kms activated windows to a a hwid activated pro (your point 1)? When upgraded from home to pro via key you can always use an appropiate kms emulator, they convert whatever is needed to be able to activate 10.
     
  3. Gharlane00

    Gharlane00 MDL Addicted

    Aug 26, 2009
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    His stated goal is to end up with either Ent or Edu without losing any part of his current Basic installation. The upgrade path to Ent requires Pro. Basic is designed to upgrade to Edu so he should be looking down that path for the sake of simplicity. Not sure if a foolproof procedure has been posted here.
     
  4. Enthousiast

    Enthousiast MDL Tester

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    It was asked just out of curiousity ;) However he ends up with the desired edition, kms emulator will activate it :D
     
  5. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    At this moment and for some more time that will work, sure! But, once MS will change the Activation process also for the Corporate (Enterprise) Version as well as for the Educational Version! Maybe similar as MS has done with the HWID, or something like that, or a very new way! And I believe, that will not be very far in the future!
     
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  6. Enthousiast

    Enthousiast MDL Tester

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    #6 Enthousiast, Mar 24, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2016
    Ehhh, how will the op activate ent/edu without any kind of kms emulator? he states he wants a kms based activation.

    For xp pro we had corp keys
    For vista we had a daz like activator (and later daz)
    For 7 we had daz
    For 8.x/10 we had kms
    For the future we will have another solution ;)
     
  7. 100

    100 MDL Expert

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    #7 100, Mar 24, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 20, 2017
  8. WyldWolf

    WyldWolf MDL Junior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
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    Ok see 100's post is that possible?

    To clarify other answers, yes I am very familiar with KMS (MS kit rocks).....and was aware of the HOME--->EDU path...however.....is there or is there not TWO version of EDU like I have now read, both a MAK and KMS? So, can you go from a OEM HW activated------>EDU but KMS EDU direct?

    My thought was why can't you do exactly what 100 posted? I literally have yet to see a blog or post that says "this is easy, just go HOME-->PRO then PRO--->ENT and you're done" so it really looked to me like HOME and PRO can be "key" upgraded, right?...But then to go to any KMS activation edition always requires inserting new VLK media which is exactly why there is no official upgrade from a retail to VLK, right?

    So again with all that said if my last paragraph is still correct today, 100's method wouldn't work because at no point did you insert actual VLK media with the different DLLs for KMS and install anything. Thoughts?

    And then if my last paragraph is also correct, how can one really go from a retail/OEM install of HOME <or> even PRO to a KMS dll's version of ENT or even the supported EDU WITHOUT RUNNING INSTALL MEDIA to update the KMS dlls etc?

    Sure you can see why this path is confusing. And just to kick it home, if i'm lucky and my last paragraph is accurate, back to the other question - to get around this with prior OS' the totally unsupported "MDL" method would have been, hack the registry to tell current OEM/HOME it is already at ENT or EDU, and put that KMS media in and do a BS "upgrade" over the top which then DOES upgrade/alter those required DLLs to change from static to VLK........and has anyone documented if that old hack reg method works in WIN10 to alter a running non-VLK to identify as one (ENT/EDU) just to run that very same upgrade over the top with VLK media?

    The more I go over this the more interested I am becoming in developing an automated single-click method to go from WIN10 OEM/HOME directly to VLK ENT (Like 100's post). @100, out of curiosity have you tried that or is that theory? I plan on now trying in a VM but thought I'd ask. Since ENT is <only> VLK, I keep reading that 2nd step fails for people trying to go from a static non-VLK binary install simply trying to change keys/pkg.
     
  9. WyldWolf

    WyldWolf MDL Junior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
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    100, then I'm confused why on earth is there VLK media? So you are stating that EVERY binary install of WIN10 has 100% of the binaries needed for ALL types of activation?

    I'm not calling you a liar, but I'm also not quite buying that it is as easy as you make is sound - but I will certainly start my own testing to help the effort.

    If true, this is the FIRST MS OS I've seen in my almost 30 yrs in IT to not require you insert actual VLK media and install those binaries to perform VLK-based KMS activation, period. That much I am 100% positive about. Confused about these 40 combination BS WIN10 edition combinations, yes but I'm not confused about the fact that VLK media is physically different in the binaries than OEM/retail installations. That link you sent is actually one of the many I read but here's what it DOESN'T SAY - remember, you can have TWO VERSIONS of PRO - retail/static activated and VLK (MAK/KMS) and there in lies the issue. The only way I can see a command line magically switching a NON-VLK installation to a VLK-based MAK or KMS one would be if every installation of WIN10 despite the edition contained the same binaries as the VLK ENT media which is doesn't, right?

    Remember, I can find just as many posts of people stating they tried DISM or changepk which we know works going from HOME to PRO, then when they tried to go from static activated PRO to the only ENT version there is (VLK MAK or KMS) that it fails. Perhaps the real issue there is not going from an already KMS activated PRO to ENT, but instead it's not possible to use changepk or DISM to go from a MAK activated PRO to ENT?

    Sorry I do appreciate the help I'm not trying to be difficult, I came to ask someone who actually tested if they knew the answer and I will now start running these tests in a VM too to try to help others with the same question but would love to hear others experience that can say "this method worked for me". I anticipate that I may be correct in that you can use the public static act retail key with DISM or changepk as you stated to go from HOME to PRO but you cannot take a HOME and upgrade to PRO using a KMS PRO key because the installation simply is not based on VLK binary media and that is the hangup.

    Love to hear other's experiences on this. I plan on recording some sessions on this and posting them to youtube and then developing (and demonstrating) a method for all the folks that bought a laptop running WIN10 HOME that want a quick, straight-forward method to jump it directly to a KMS activated version of ENT. If I need to develop a tool to do it I will. If your above 2 commands are magical and do it then Phase 1 is complete. Phase 2 would them be a tool to allow an in-place upgrade from older HOME OEM entitlement build to a 2015-ENT-LTSB KMS and/or ENT-TH2 KMS build.
     
  10. 100

    100 MDL Expert

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    I am. VL media is just different in that it defaults to KMS and doesn't prompt for a product key.

    Then why would there be a direct upgrade path at all from an exclusively non-VL edition (Home) to a VL-only edition (Education)?

    I'm afraid you are mistaken. Windows 10 is, however, the first OS release that allows an edition change to Enterprise.
     
  11. Myrrh

    Myrrh MDL Expert

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    Vista, 7, 8, 8.1 all had the "anytime upgrade" which would accept a KMS client key.

    Windows 10 adds Enterprise and Education to the available upgrades using this path.
     
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  12. Gharlane00

    Gharlane00 MDL Addicted

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    #13 Gharlane00, Mar 24, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2016
    According to Microsoft, there is no actual difference between Education and Enterprise SKUs other than the cost to license them. That and LTSB is only available with an enterprise license. As far as I know there is no path to convert to LTSB from any SKU.
    Going through an extra step to go from Basic to Pro to Enterprise rather than Basic to Education does not have any benefit.


    And for the record, I changed from Pro to Enterprise through the previously shown command line and it was just that easy.
     
  13. 100

    100 MDL Expert

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    Functionally there's no difference, but Enterprise differs from Education in that it doesn't receive "current branch" updates through WU. Also, Education forces a desktop watermark to be shown.
     
  14. Gharlane00

    Gharlane00 MDL Addicted

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    The machine that is running Enterprise is in the Fast ring so it should always be fully updated through WU
     
  15. WyldWolf

    WyldWolf MDL Junior Member

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    blogs? msdn? microsoft? com/beanexpert/2015/08/17/how-to-upgrade-windows-10-edition-using-provisioning-package/

    MS blog end of 1st section "Note that you can’t upgrade from Windows 10 Home to Enterprise".

    But everyone here seems to agree that WIN10 is different in the VLK media now is irrelavent in the binaries? WIN7 and prior was not - you CANNOT KMS activate a retail binary media install of WIN7 and prior - you needed to reinstall using VLK media - it's always been that way.

    So, if you guys are telling me that's new and now the VLK media is irrelevant to what's physically installed on the C: drive, and a simple key change can take the OEM binaries and change it to ANY edition that is KMS activated - that is HUGE news to me and I think all the posts I've read. I also find not a single tutorial saying "just change your OEM laptop to an Enterprise or EDU KMS key and KMS activate it", but since you guys are saying it's that easy I'll proceed with testing in VMs and recording it and I guess I'll write the 1st step by step easy blog. If I'm wrong and you can show me a blog or instruction even here on MDL that I missed then I sincerely apologize I simply am not seeing them, nor references to folks saying "just enter the public KMS ENT or EDU key on your new laptop and KMS activate it".

    As for the EDU and ENT differences, according to MS the LTSB is the major differnence in the SKUs, and the ability to "easy" upgrade from Home: www?microsoft?com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/Compare

    EDU also supports both MAK and KMS keys, again I want to see with my own eyes that you can upgrade from home to EDU using the KMS EDU key from an OEM perm act and not required to use a perm MAK key for the upgrade. That's #2 on my test list right after the claim that HOME/OEM/PERM ACT--->ENT KMS is not only possible, but as easy as a package/key change. :)
     
  16. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    What the user want, will never be a concern of MS!

    The History of KMS service goes quite far back! And as for DAZ Loader (and others), Corporate Keys's etc., it's just a matter of time MS will go another new way, as shown in the past already!

    The corporate are the main business for Microsoft, so the Edu as well! Do you really think that MS will let it go as it does tight now? I hardly believe that! MS will already work on a new way to stop the unwanted influences of not the legal use of their OS'es! It's not just their right, it's a must if they want to stay in that business! That they couldn't protect the whole, they know very well. That's just the simple reason behind their changes in Windows 10 'Free' Giveaway for a year, and even longer for the members of the insider system! Sure the second reason for that is, MS will get the needed information easy and freely from members of those Insider circle, directly and indirectly (via the 'Home Calls')!

    They also get a lot of info from Forums like MDL and others, just presented openly by the Forums Members! It's the fasted way for MS to get really relevant information, within a very short time from a lot different sites, from users users who're not pretend to develop some code, instead to find way's to 'bypass' any kind protection etc., even if it's 'just' to show MS: We can do it!, We can use it! And so on!

    I don't think that the KMS will last much longer!
     
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  17. endbase

    endbase MDL Guru

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    #19 endbase, Mar 25, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2016
    It was easy but microsoft changed the way activation works in the past 2 months I believe tried to Upgrade from pro to enterprise not working any more by key ! 2 monts ago it was no problem you jut inserted enterprise key an voila it worked like a charm. So don't be too hard on these guys for saying that it can be done easy. Blame Microsoft for making it hard instead ;)

    ps after all I had to do an clean install of LTSB after trying to go from pro to enterprise to LTSB :eek:
     
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  18. WyldWolf

    WyldWolf MDL Junior Member

    Dec 29, 2010
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    Well this is TH2 1511 and I just got activated but have to do some more testing I think something in the newer build core activation changed when they started accepting the WIN7/8 keys to quietly also include a change with the KMS act behavior and whether forcing the KMS host etc now results in the key validating and even using the "activate" gui button to then activate works after previously failing. Again I'm still re-testing need to roll back my snapshots and start fresh to reproduce what I just saw but this may open the door to easier switching if I could automate and enforce the order in which it all happens.