Windows 10 Failed update (again)

Discussion in 'Windows 10' started by Nimbus2000, Apr 13, 2016.

  1. Nimbus2000

    Nimbus2000 MDL Member

    May 5, 2010
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    My main desktop computer is setup to multi-boot with Windows 7, Windows 8.1, Windows 10, and several versions of Linux / BSD. Since yesterday was “Patch Tuesday”, I made a point to install the Windows updates. Win 7 updated without issue but was VERY slow. Windows 8.1 also had no issues and was considerably faster.

    Windows 10 turned out to be a big problem. Halfway through the process, the computer blue screened and rebooted. I decided to forget about updating Windows 10 and booted into Linux Mint. Unfortunately I discovered that I was not to get off easy. Mint refused to mount a separate NTFS partition that I use for common data. As it turns out, when Windows 10 bombed it had corrupted the file system. It took quite a while to fix the problems but eventually I was successful.

    I set the computer up so that each operating system is completely isolated from the others. Windows 10 is on it's own SSD. Why it would corrupt the data on a different hard drive / partition is perplexing and totally unacceptable. This is not the first time Windows 10 updates have caused major heartburn. I am considering removing Windows 10 as it is more trouble than it is worth.

    Microsoft has some serious issues with Windows 10, not to mention the privacy issues and other questionable policy decisions. I currently use Linux for about 95% of my computing need and only boot into Windows when I absolutely need to. I only wish I could dump Windows entirely. :weep:

    OK, soapbox mode is off, I just needed to vent some steam due to all the aggravation Microsoft has been sending my way...
     
  2. trungpt

    trungpt MDL Addicted

    Dec 15, 2009
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    Windows 10 on my tablet was updated sucessfully.

    I also have Windows 7 on one of my two PCs updated. The other one is still checking for updates:(
     
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  3. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    How I see it, the problem you face isn't about Windows 10, is about the way you use multiple OS'es with the Windows Boot Manager!


    I also use multiple OS'es, just use the BIOS Boot Manager for to chose from what Harddisk, and therefore which OS I like to use to boot into! OK, that requires, that on one HDD is just one OS installed! The simple fact is, unlike the Windows Boot Manager, the BIOS Boot Manager didn't interfere with the other OS'es like Windows Boot Manager did! Special, if you use to have more than one OS installed on the same HDD, the Windows Boot Manager need to change the Boot sequence on the fly, and will write back some data to the HDD using. That may end up in trouble, which could get that far, that it damage the (Boot-)structure of the HDD.


    Since years I use the BIOS Boot Manager without any problems on the above-described way: ONE OS on ONE HDD only!! All user's I know, include some of my customers and also my own staff, using the Windows Boot Manager, ended up many times in sometimes unrecoverable problems! Today all my staff use the BIOS Boot Manager, with the exception of one person, who just couldn't accept that the Windows Boot Manager is faulty! He has already received the cancellation of his contract, which runs out the end of June, until that time he's only allowed to use a Company computer for to work!


    If I were you, I would change the Boot Manager immediately to the BIOS Boot Manager. And just to say, even third party Boot Manager Apps, are prohibited in my Company!!
     
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  4. emanuelrv

    emanuelrv MDL Novice

    Dec 25, 2014
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    that why i use oracle virtual box any problem dont screw all the systems
     
  5. Enthousiast

    Enthousiast MDL Tester

    Oct 30, 2009
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    You're on a very specific situation, blaiming msft for this error is very fast to conclude. Could it be the hdd/ssd has failures? etcetc...
     
  6. Nimbus2000

    Nimbus2000 MDL Member

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    @pisthai - I never said that I use the Microsoft boot manager. In fact, each version of Windows is installed on it's own hard drive and the LInux / BSD installs on another. Hitting F12 at boot time allows me to select which drive / os to load. I have configured the computer so that each OS can only see it's own drive and the partition used for common files.

    @Enthousiast - No physical problems with any hard drives. Windows 10 is installed on an SSD that is only a few months old. The manufacturer's diagnostic utility and smart / sector scans report no problems. It simply blue screened while installing an update and left two other drives that were not dismounted cleanly. The Windows 10 install is almost pristine. There are no applications installed other than what was included in the initial install. It blue screened while installing an update from Microsoft. Who else should I blame? :confused:
     
  7. andruszd

    andruszd MDL Novice

    May 26, 2011
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    Have you got a dump file in C:\Windows\LiveKernelReports or in the mini dumps directory as this will tell you why the blue screen happpend.
     
  8. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    You wrote:


    which looks like you use the Windows own, or a 3.party Boot Manager!

    What are your BIOS Settings for all HDD's (incl. SSD)? There for sure several options, include IDE, RAID, AHCI or others, and there're settings for Fast Boot, Secure Boot, Legacy etc.!

    It also could be a problem of the Windows 10 Kernel, it may not compatible with your BIOS at all! Had you updated the BIOS of your machine to the latest available? If not, that's maybe something to be done too!
     
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  9. Nimbus2000

    Nimbus2000 MDL Member

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    @andruszd - No logs found. I tried using the "whatcrashed" utility, but corrupted files were cleaned as part of the repair process.

    @pisthai - I have been running Windows 10 on this machine since the Technical Preview build 9841 (10/2014) and have never had compatibility issues. All hard drives are set to use AHCI with secure boot disabled. I have 2 SSD's and 4 conventional hard drives. All use MBR except the 4 TB data drive.

    I had one other episode where an update fouled up my ability to configure networking. It was fixed a few days later when Microsoft pushed out a fix. I have also had two other people bring me their computers after a Windows 10 update caused severe problems. One was a video driver update that cause the machine to display nothing but wide colored lines across the screen. The second was when an update disabled the keyboard. I know that bad updates have been around for years but it sure seems that Windows 10 has WAY more than usual and they are more severe as well. I could understand this if these machines were fast ring but that is not the case here.
     
  10. glennsamuel32

    glennsamuel32 MDL Senior Member

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    #11 glennsamuel32, Apr 16, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2016
    Have you hidden the drives with a 3rd party app, so each OS just sees the HD that it's running on ?
    Or do you just connect the drive you're booting the OS from ? (you mentioned earlier 2 drives didn't dismount properly, so I figure no)

    Just curious about the app that actually isolates partitions and disks ;)
     
  11. T-S

    T-S MDL Guru

    Dec 14, 2012
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    I think you haven't clear the difference between corrupted and dirty filesystem.

    If Windows crashes is very likely that the ntfs partitions (all of them) becomes marked as dirty. No matter if the filesystem is ok or corrupted.

    In such condition Linux refuses to mount them as a safety measure. All you have to do is either check them with a windows system or launch ntfsfix from linux to mark them as clean.

    That's all
     
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  12. Nimbus2000

    Nimbus2000 MDL Member

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    Previously, I used the GAG bootloader and configured it to hide the other operating systems. That worked very well but when I switched to my current method (one OS per hard drive), I used disk management to hide the unused disks. I could enter the bios setup and disable the unused sata ports each time I boot, but that would be very cumbersome.

    @T-S - Unfortunately it was not just a dirty file system, there actually were corrupted files (a bunch of them) on the Windows 10 drive and the common data drive. I had this happen once before and thought it was related to hybrid shutdown, so I have turned that feature off. So what if it takes a little longer to boot. With an SSD on fast machine the difference is not significant.

    I think the focus of this thread is drifting away from my main concern, specifically the poor job Microsoft is doing to make sure updates are stable before releasing them. This is especially troubling because most Windows 10 users have no control over the update process.
     
  13. T-S

    T-S MDL Guru

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    #14 T-S, Apr 16, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2016

    Look I'm anything but an ms fanboy, but honestly I think we can criticize MS for a long list of things, but the stability is pretty good since the early days of XP.

    99.999% of the crashes are due to poor/cheap HW, to poorly written or incompatible or too old drivers, or to poor user behavior, and are pretty rare.

    Get a thinkpad, get a Latitude (even cheap five years old ones), get a good ssd and blue screens will be matter of the past

    The win95 days and the prayers for a good boot are long gone.
     
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  14. 100

    100 MDL Expert

    May 17, 2011
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    #15 100, Apr 16, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2016
    As long as you stick to integrated graphics on older models, that is. I can only speak for ThinkPads, but I've had those break on me due to discrete GPU failure (ATI on W500, as well as (obviously) nVidia on T61p), and then have the warranty replacements break again.
    iGPU models really are solid though (typing this on an X200s).
     
  15. T-S

    T-S MDL Guru

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    #16 T-S, Apr 16, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2016
    Yes. Sure. Personally I never bought any with an external GPU except my ancient TC1000/TC1100, and a deal I had buying a Latitude 6410 (one of the most powerfull and updated 16/10 notebooks available) which was Nvidia powered. And surely both of them were more problematic than AMD and Intel notebooks.

    The X200s is still one of the best notebook ever, providing it with an SSD makes it an incredible machine even today.
     
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  16. glennsamuel32

    glennsamuel32 MDL Senior Member

    Jul 15, 2012
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    Completely agree with you on this point...
    A long time ago, I started disabling hibernation, system restore and defender...
    No issues with updates except those that were flawed and the fixes were always documented on the web...
    If anyone uses an anti-virus, my advise is to always disable it before updating...
     
  17. Nimbus2000

    Nimbus2000 MDL Member

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    @T-S - I agree that in general stability is better EXCEPT with updates. Microsoft is rushing things and lots of faulty patches are slipping through.
     
  18. LiteOS

    LiteOS MDL Expert

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    #19 LiteOS, Apr 17, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
    They have too many branches to maintain and no enuf staff
    while need to create new features for newer version

    Hopefully we'll see improvement after rs1 release