Remember the world is analogue. There are many variations even on how and why you install LTSx. First: LTSC has better policies, and even if you install all the crap bundled in Home/Pro it's still better. Second: appx can be installed w/o the store (and a MS account) Third: late W10 and W11 aren't W8 or LTSB 2015, where you can remove every appx and still have a 100% functional system, let alone what will happen in the future. Fourth OEMs are slowly but constantly migrating specific utilities (say to control the battery behavior) to appx, so you have to deal with some appx anyway.... Fifth some appx are just subs for normal w32 apps, even Linux nowadays is an appx, albeit obviously has next to nothing to do with either apps or win32 programs I can continue, but you got the point
With LTSC you use an older build of Windows. Is any theoretical advantages really going to be that great if you're going to use store apps anyway? Why not just use the latest Pro version and change a couple of settings?
Older of what? As long as updates are released, it's a 30 days old build in the worst case. Yeah, tell me which setting should I use to get support for 5/10 years on Pro
As far as I can tell, IoT LTSC is the ultimate version for a number of reasons. Firstly, it’s supported for ten years. Out of the gate, it runs lean - you only add what you need, so it’s not a mess of ads, distractions, and unnecessary/unwanted apps. In addition, as an enterprise version it’s fully featured and capable of handling any policies that you throw at it. Finally, it will never get surprising feature updates that add a bunch of nonsense while breaking the previous configuration. As a DJ Producer, I moved away from Apple when every MacOS update held the risk of breaking my legacy software’s compatibility while affecting performance. I moved to LTSC back when 2019 was the current version. I’m now running IoT LTSC - properly licensed as an OEM builder of Digital Audio Workstation appliances designed to work in a live environment where updates and upgrades won’t impact the performance. If it’s good enough for an ATM or MRI machine, it’s good enough to host Ableton Live, rekordbox, and all my VSTs. As far as Windows goes, it’s the best.
I'd really not rather get into the 5gb of updates debate again so I'll drop the issue on the older build topic. However, on the other issue, what support are you expecting? Security Updates? Do you really think that Windows Updates do anything to secure you from modern malware? I don't even use an Anti-Virus program because they're useless. I use my brain. I avoid clicking things I shouldn't click on.
I wholly agree with you. Security-wise, common sense trumps anything from a “newer” build. Is there any evidence to suggest that Win11 21H2 is more secure than a fully updated Win10 LTSC (21H2)? As far as I can tell, even BlackLotus would be fully mitigated if the media was updated before installation. There’s enough zero-day malware floating out there at any given time that would have the same effect on a new build of Windows 11 or an outdated Windows version, and it isn’t getting better anytime soon.
Uh.. I almost forgot that facts and measurement units are outdated concepts at your place I'm typing on Win8 Release Preview, right now. What *I* expect is not relevant. What people expect IS. It's just matter of intellectual honesty. If you tell to non expert / less expert people that "A" is the same thing as "B", while B has MANY major difference you're not doing a good thing. And my too, but what that has to do with what was discussed here? Pro is worse than LTSB/C, Period. And it's still worse even when you make what I call "GhettoLTSB". Cleaning and removing as much as you can, tweaking policies and so on the result has still disadvantages over the real thing. It's pretty simple, unless you like to debate just for fun.
I agree, which is why I use LTSC, but I never chose it for the 10 years of supposed support. I chose it because it doesn't have the store. I chose it because it doesn't auto-add store apps. I chose it because it doesn't automatically use web-searching in the taskbar. I don't even download updates anymore. It's one of the first things I disable after installing the OS. Unless I specifically need a newer .NET version for something, I really find that there isn't any point when you don't want the security updates. All it seems to do is bloat up your system and slow it down. As far as debate, you're the one who tagged me in. Either stop tagging me in or wait till I get bored of replying.
I think the main idea behind win11 was that your data would already be encrypted with bitlocker which was forced with TPM chips. That was the major concern at the time. Most of us know that the encrypted ransomware was only one of many types of malware out there. I feel like a lot of the security updates are a bit counter-productive. They release and give the hackers a good idea of what processes to exploit on un-patched systems. It's a bit of a catch-22. If they never released the updates until they found the malware in the wild, it would cut down on a lot of unnecessary bloat, but at the same time it would make the system less secure over time. I think Vista's update system is a bit outdated. I think they could have a system where they hold onto old updates for 3 or 6 months and then remove them. All of the patched updates get integrated into the newer code, so it's not like the update process is pointless. It just happens to annoy me, personally. It's pretty ironic given how I started.
Sometimes one quote a message not to debate with the person who posted it, but just as a starting point to extend/integrate the discussed matter. That said I share most of your personal preferences, but given we aren't discussing privately, I must take in account that other people read what I write, so I try to not be fundamentalist
I think turning on bitlocker by default is a terrible idea for home users. I have seen many cases of lost data due to drive failure. Asking the owner if they saved the key results in "deer in the headlights" looks. They don't have a clue.
A terrible idea that is already enforced on 99% of Android devices let alone the iPhones, be sure that this will be the case of Windows as well in less than 5 years.
I believe that the only updates now required to update the Windows 10 IoT Enterprise 2021 media (without NDP481) are as follows: Defender Update defender-dism-x64.cab LCU 07/11/2023 windows10.0-kb5028166-x64_fe3aa2fef685c0e76e1f5d34d529624294273f41.msu NDP35-48 07/11/2023 windows10.0-kb5028853-x64-ndp48_6d85da3883386e6e72037cca91eb745df82bbd86.msu DU for Sources 7/11/2023 windows10.0-kb5028311-x64_8750fa3c7e42f95fc70d36ee33526009a431dd24.cab Critical DU for .NET35 11/22/2021 windows10.0-kb5007401-x64_f1bf61d834bb8d9951c7efa23454643daae195b0.cab DU for SafeOS 6/13/2022 windows10.0-kb5027389-x64_8d1880d95f920fc8a4c2d96ca8d3b44f3e044581.cab If I am incorrect, please advise. I'm assuming that the NDP35-48 OOB updates are no longer necessary with the new cumulative update, but I'm fairly new to this - I've only recently been updating the media to save on build times.
you can check it's version with 7-zip and any text editior (I prefer Notepad++) download msu or cab, open it with 7-zip inside cab file you'll find text file update.mum with version number inside of it if OOB update's version is lower then it's outdated KB5028853 - 4645.5 OOB is 4645.1
Thank you. That makes a lot of sense. One thing does throw me off though. kb5029006 was released back on 29-Jun. It was actually version 4500. Do you have any idea why they'd release an OOB update when the 16-Jun NDP35-48 kb5027122 was version 4644? Doesn't that make it a useless update? Please pardon my ignorance in advance. I'm really tying to understand Microsoft's logic, but I'm probably missing something.
.NET 3.5 OOB updates are still needed (KB5029006 ~ KB5029009 / KB5028913) .NET 4.8 OOB updates are not needed (KB5028576 ~ KB5028582) components version is what matter, not update version