If God is Omniscient then Human is not free.

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by sid_16, Apr 9, 2013.

?

Free will doesn't exist If God is omniscient.

  1. If yes, why?

    36 vote(s)
    44.4%
  2. If no, then how?

    45 vote(s)
    55.6%
  1. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

    Dec 31, 2015
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    Let me put it this way: I have been teaching philosophy for a few decades, in several universities on different contiments. But as some us do, we try to never stop learning. The problem with learning is that whoever has another opinion about a subject, needs to have arguments, not Believes.


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    bilder upload
     
  2. CHEF-KOCH

    CHEF-KOCH MDL Expert

    Jan 7, 2008
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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_of_Ockham


    :dicht::hangloose:
     
  3. ausernamenoonehas

    ausernamenoonehas MDL Member

    Aug 2, 2015
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    That mocking poster clearly shows its maker knows absolutely nothing about the trinity.
     
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  4. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

    Feb 13, 2011
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    But I am here why do all of you feel alone. :eek:
     
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  5. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

    Jan 25, 2012
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    God has the power to control it, but GOD chooses NOT TO, because GOD WANTS NOT TO.
    Wrong. Imagine this scenario:
    There's an employee and a boss. The boss knows that actions taken by the employee will decrease the stock value of the company, yet the boss chooses not to interfere at all. This means the boss is less powerful? Don't think so...
     
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  6. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

    Feb 13, 2011
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    Wow let me get this straight, you know the mind of God !
     
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  7. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

    Jan 25, 2012
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    Weeeeell...GOD made human in ITS Image, so, for the sake of explanation I put myself in ITS "shoes". Not intervening in human affairs is the Ultimate Love GOD has for its creation. The "bad things" are all part of the learning process of humanity knowing itself.

    P.S. The explanation is so simple that it "pisses off" some people...
     
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  8. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

    Dec 31, 2015
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  9. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

    Dec 31, 2015
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    While you KNOW about the trinity ????

    Just face it: You are a believer. If you cannot live accepting the fact, that you know nothing, then go ahead. But allow others not to take you seriously. That is a small price to pay, when on judgement day, God will tell you what good boy you have been. Right?
     
  10. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

    Dec 31, 2015
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    "God has the power to control it, but GOD chooses NOT TO, because GOD WANTS NOT TO."

    I guess, you are sorry you have deleted the e-mail in which he confirmed that you personally? Otherwise you would prove it to us immediately?

    [​IMG]
     
  11. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

    Dec 31, 2015
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    Yes, this forist does....

    Be afraid ! Be very afraid !!!!
     
  12. ThomasMann

    ThomasMann MDL Expert

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    Let me take a wild guess here... the ones that it pisses off, those are intelligent ones?


    (Hey, I really like this thread.. Nothing like a good laugh early in the morning.)
     
  13. ausernamenoonehas

    ausernamenoonehas MDL Member

    Aug 2, 2015
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    Ah back to the origins I see. Yes the "intelligent" ones indeed. Just as Satan lied to Eve. And what was the sum of Satan's lie?

    By eating the fruit of the KNOWLEDGE of good and evil, her mind will be opened and she will be just like God?

    Yup, a good dose of "intelligence" sure sorted out humanity ...

    Thus far this "intelligence" has given us the ability to create ways of killing each other and the planet we share.

    Now "intelligence" COMBINED with a guide on how to use this "intelligence" .ie The Bible, which by and large suggests it would be in our best interests to love one another, not to lie, not to murder and so on, is considered stupidity? :confused:

    When I look at mankind's so called "intelligence" I see a LOT to be desired. Of coarse man being completely corrupt he'll even go as low as using "religion" as means of power and control. But that is only accomplished by the ignorant who follow man instead of Gods word.

    Of coarse there will be those who will "intellectualize" the Bible on interpretation and meaning, whilst at the same time completely ignoring its basic message. Thereby completely missing the fundamentals and focusing on what they desire the outcome to be.

    And as before we come full circle, back to the garden and Eve and the lie of knowledge and its corrupting influence on the mind. So we have "intelligence" of both good and evil. And thus God now leaves us to choose which one we love more ...

    Its pretty basic overall. Do you love good or do you love evil? Its your choice to choose in life. Its something of which we are all confronted with on a daily basis.

    Some people simply choose to take note of their disease, the infection of knowledge between good and evil and the resulting corruption it brings and check the manual for a fix. Its no great mystery. The Bible simply says hey you got infected, here's a guide to help you get by. The more you study, the more you implement its advice, the better you'll be. Simple.

    Man on the other hand takes the manual and sees it as an opportunity for profit, power, control and every other form of evil imaginable. Which I guess is a testament to truly how sick we are.

    Personally I'd love to rinse my mind of knowledge of good and evil and simply know only good. But in this world? I'd be eaten alive. Too late now, damage has been done. Have to spend the rest of my life infected with this vile condition and daily battle its effects.

    Thankfully I'm not alone. God is there every step of the way to help and guide me towards choosing good instead of evil.

    Being evil is so unoriginal. Be cool, be edgy choose good. :p
     
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  14. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
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    I have a question...

    Can I choose to be a decent person and choose not to follow religious dogma?
     
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  15. ausernamenoonehas

    ausernamenoonehas MDL Member

    Aug 2, 2015
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    Absolutely 100% !!!!!

    Most people won't believe this, but Jesus was probably the most anti-religious person who ever lived!

    Its stands to reason why the "RELIGIOUS" high counsel were the very one's to call for Jesus' death. Pontius Pilate actually declared he could find no fault in Jesus after he was tasked with examining him. Even going so far as to offer a murderous criminal or Jesus to be set free (which was according to custom) in the hope when a murderous criminal was offered, people would choose to set free this innocent man (as far as Pontius Pilate was concerned he was innocent) and he'd be free from condemning an innocent man to the most gruesome death the Roman empire had at the time. But no, the religious men of the day riled up the crowd to chant "crucify Him" and left Pontius Pilate with no choice.

    The reason why the religious order of the day wanted Jesus killed is the real pearl of the story. Simply put, Jesus called them out for the hypocrites they are, using religion as a means to 1. make a buck (driving them out of the temple) if you remember the story "My Fathers house shall be called a house of prayer, you have made it a den of thieves"
    2. Using religion as a means of power over the people. 3. Using religious as a means of control. (Not a lot has changed huh?)

    That's probably the biggest surprise people (honest people, who read the Bible without preconceived ideas) find. That Jesus came to SHOW mankind that religion is bogus and a weight no man should have to bear. And its about a personal relationship with God according to scripture.

    Can you choose to be a decent person and choose not to follow religious dogma? There's actually no other way.
     
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  16. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

    Jan 25, 2012
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    Dear gorski/ThomasMann,

    The explanation pisses off the people with an ego with the size of planet Earth, that have the impression if they know how to cut the egg, they expect to find the chicken.
     
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  17. JFKI

    JFKI MDL Expert

    Oct 25, 2015
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    In my eyes, Absolutely.
     
  18. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

    Jan 12, 2012
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    And do not forget, that Jesus also came to serve others to set an example as to how we should live. (Love your neighbor ... ect) The things that Christ said and did are not suggestions, they are commandments of the new covenant
     
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  19. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

    Jan 25, 2012
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    God is not religious, only some humans...
     
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  20. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

    Oct 21, 2009
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    What a troll, Soccy... :D :D :D
     
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