Moving AWAY from Microsoft products IS very much possible for many people.

Discussion in 'Linux' started by smallhagrid, Dec 17, 2018.

  1. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
    4,071
    4,651
    150
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  2. Krager

    Krager MDL Senior Member

    Jan 9, 2017
    396
    233
    10
    I think that article is actually the prank, was a serious effort from Bell Labs originally written by Ken Thompson and Dennis Ritchie under their employ. Was developed for use in-house without the intent to develop a commercially licensed system. Thompson then spent a year sabbatical at UC Berkeley where he continued to work on Unix with his graduate students and BSD was born.

    Some years later the BSD code was made open behind lots of commercial variants. Distros like FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD are direct descendants of the original BSD Unix. Those distros tightly conform to the standards and you can see the difference pretty obviously as a user when compared to Linux.
     
  3. smallhagrid

    smallhagrid MDL Addicted

    Sep 14, 2013
    608
    445
    30
    #43 smallhagrid, Dec 31, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2018
    (OP)
    TOO CUTE !!! :
    Thank You for the cuteness & some giggles Michaela Joy !!

    I suppose if one is a high-level user with some confidence & particular needs that applies quite accurately - however:
    The average Joe or Jane can easily manage to answer the very few, very simple questions in (for example) an Ubuntu install (KB language, locale, username...and so forth) and have an operable system in well under 1/2 hour.

    OR:

    For those less than confident it is easy enough to have a friend who IS confident do this for them, maybe also do a little bit of tinkering if any is desired - and hand it to them all ready to use.

    Here is specifically what tickles me the most about Linux (being the happy tinkerer that I am...) :
    I got a new system ready for an elderly friend just lately and packaged up a full backup of it on a bootable USB stick using Systemback, and then=>
    Pulled an older, very crotchety (different brand) notebook off the shelf - booted it with that backup & told it to install...
    Less than 10 minutes later I was using an EXACT & fully functional clone of that friend's PC.

    No driver nonsense AT ALL - even the wifi connection made itself & became 100% ready to use right away.
    The only input it needed from me was the changed username, host name & PW.
    Boom - done. Browsing...with no fussing or delays.
    I have made this test a bunch of times to test backups & it has always worked - even transferring all user data & settings if desired - resulting in an exact duplication.

    Comparing that operation with a similarly 'bare metal' OS transfer with a windows OS to totally different h/w:
    Instead of coming right up & being ready to use, there are numerous driver searches & installations, lots of fiddling & diddling (tinkering) with at least several reboots & FINALLY only then if all that went in perfectly it might climb onto the internet.

    So say this isn't better or worse either way - no biggie IMO - but there IS definitely MORE TINKERING with windows to get the initial OS in - fully up & running and then connected to the internet.

    THe end product for my elderly and/or 100% technically challenged friends has been that of getting a PC that just goes along trouble free for years after the little bit I did helping them to get it set up - and no worries for them in their simple daily uses of email, browsing, word processing, and so forth.

    Escaping forever from such discomforts as winrot & BSODs has made those folks all into very happy 'Nix users who are also delighted in NOT having to pay the 'antivirus tax' anymore !!

    Best Wishes for a Happy & Healthy New Year to ALL.
     
  4. Krager

    Krager MDL Senior Member

    Jan 9, 2017
    396
    233
    10
    You know what strikes me the most going between Windows and Unix is I do just about all my system setup on Unix at the command line. There is some mousing when I get into the X windows environment, doing stuff like editing documents and web browsing, but setup and configuration is all at the command line.

    Most people probably think that's just so inefficient to be doing all that command line stuff, but I actually like it. I don't think I've once thought, "gee wish I could be doing this with a mouse and check box." I'm probably odd that way though.

    In any case if you want to play with Unix, better get used to that command line.
     
  5. Krager

    Krager MDL Senior Member

    Jan 9, 2017
    396
    233
    10
    To be fair, I've not had much trouble with either system in terms of blue screens versus kernel panics. Since Windows XP it seems the Windows kernel is actually quite stable. The only time it's given me trouble is when something is faulty. The same can be said for Linux and BSD. I've had kernel panics with those before, but one or the other does not stand out as more frequent. Blue screens might have kernel panics beat by some margin, but it's not a big one.

    Winrot seems to be less of an issue with newer versions of Windows. WinXP did need to be refreshed with a clean install every year or two. Win7 seemed more robust to me and I have not used Win10 long enough to say. Whatever the case the Windows registry is a hulking beast and can be prone to issues over time. There's no such thing in Unix. Only flat out disc corruption can cause a problem there. It's much more robust in that way.
     
  6. finderz

    finderz MDL Member

    Dec 20, 2009
    103
    49
    10
    Win98 and Win98SE have the worst kernel when MS was trying to clamp down on piracy with the illegal operation crap. WinXP was getting better after SP2 all the way until they invade the privacy of its user and force things down our throat in Win10.

    Recently I have found manjaro which is making much progress as an alternative for windows, it isn't perfect but it is improving and is getting stable. Just waiting for more windows software developer to offer linux version just like apps for iOS and Android. Who know the next windows alternative OS may be manjaro which is becoming more user friendly. :)
     
  7. kiddo4

    kiddo4 MDL Novice

    Apr 11, 2015
    26
    8
    0
    You want stable? Just use Debian. :)
     
  8. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    #48 Muerto, Feb 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
    ...
     
  9. eztwister

    eztwister MDL Novice

    May 28, 2014
    1
    0
    0
    i had to go back to windows (10, ugh) on a bootable usb drive to dual boot windowstogo so that i could properly run photoshop after wine emulation finally broke

    other than that i love ubuntu. switched a year ago because win7 was nearing end of life and my windows laptop died
     
  10. Krager

    Krager MDL Senior Member

    Jan 9, 2017
    396
    233
    10
    I'm envious of you guys, I just can't seem to break free of Windows. It's a fascist system from a fascist company. Win7 was tolerable, could massage it into something decent. Win10 is insufferable. I only recently moved to Win10 with a new laptop computer, it's been three months now and I still haven't got it whipped into shape. Don't know if I ever will. The latest horror with win10 and me is they decided to only half support network browsing which is something I've always relied on. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't. It's always going to be like that, they're not going to fix it.
     
  11. smallhagrid

    smallhagrid MDL Addicted

    Sep 14, 2013
    608
    445
    30
    Wonderfully well said - thank you !! :
    And yet there are so many who are just CERTAIN that the PC itself -is- M$;
    Therein lies the staying power of all that gang's wrongdoings.
     
  12. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    #52 Muerto, Feb 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
    ...
     
  13. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    #53 Muerto, Feb 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
    ...
     
  14. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
    4,071
    4,651
    150
    @QuantumBug: I agree. The only thing keeping me from tinkering with 'nix is lack of a second machine.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  15. Krager

    Krager MDL Senior Member

    Jan 9, 2017
    396
    233
    10
    Funny you bring up systemd. That is was what turned me off to Linux, long time Debian user before that. Not just the fact it's an awful program, but the whole fiasco in its adoption. Demonstrated some big negatives in the the way Linux does business.

    I do have a distro I like and that's FreeBSD. It has a really nice Linux emulator so anything that runs on Linux can run on FreeBSD. I really like the FreeBSD organization. Solid leadership and clear mission. You'd never see a fiasco like systemd with them.

    I had a big office with several machines and one of those was running FreeBSD subsequent to Debian. Unfortunately my living situation changed and I had to drop down to a single laptop computer, no space for an office. Windows won the bid so I bought a non-BSD friendly laptop. I can't run FreeBSD on this one.

    There are BSD friendly laptops and I should have bought one of those. I would have knowing what I know now about win10. I honestly didn't think Windows would slide so far downhill in two versions. I thought it would be like winXP to win7 which wasn't a cavernous difference.

    Next time I buy another laptop it ~will~ be BSD friendly. That may be my break away from Windows, not this round though.
     
  16. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    @smallhagrid

    I use nothing of which you mentioned, but I do get your point. Yes, in the past I've used OneNote, EverNote, Skype. But the principal is the same as what you mentioned, it's the inception of corporation control. They take away the power and they take control of users. This is why I'm Linux dominant now and use open source applications.

    The fact people say 'I've got nothing to hide' is ridiculous. You have EVERYTHING to hide. Your passwords, personal documents, scans, photos, these are all things to hide. Having 'something to hide' does not mean a BAD thing in my book. When I get TOLD by people I have something to hide with all this encryption I say 'You're damned f**king right I have something to hide'.

    Regarding Vista. It wasn't a complete failure and I somewhat* liked it. It was just insultingly ahead of it's time when it came to hardware. "*Somewhat being a very strong word in this case."

    Privacy is a dying breed; but if practice dies, so does the attached function. This is why I will practice privacy until I die.
     
  17. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    #58 Muerto, Feb 1, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
    ...
     
  18. smallhagrid

    smallhagrid MDL Addicted

    Sep 14, 2013
    608
    445
    30
    Here's a funny:
    As an IT guy, I've got 2-3 'retired' CPU boxes just hanging around, perfectly good - just replaced on a schedule.

    Also - as QuantumBug so wisely said=>
    Using different OSes via VMWare Player or VirtualBox is free, easy & makes for having just one box.
    (This is what I do too.)

    @QuantumBug:
    The killing stroke for me was when the M$ gang totally lobotomized the explorer file manager view; there was no way to get the better version back into the newer OS versions, and all the alternatives are either too complex/bloated or just not nearly as usable.
     
  19. Muerto

    Muerto MDL Debugger

    Mar 7, 2012
    1,852
    2,091
    60
    #60 Muerto, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
    ...