hm. with all respect, dear chef, i disagree with almost everything you say here. noone is waiting for a Linux Vs. Windows contest here. fact is, that - m$, and you can fill in any successful company here, like google, fbook, etc, have grown too big for their shoes. so big, in fact, that fines inflicted on them by [incompetent] governments mean nothing to them anymore. it is just money, and they have got [more than] enough of that.and-m$ is proving time and time again that they act in bad faith.towards their customers.m$ is not open source. in my book they are mere crooks producing malware. and i have never supported crooks, and at 68 i am way too old for new habits. i like open source linux, and it works well, i know. and that is the direction where we need to go, imho. and to say that m$ will go open source, is shockingly naive. just my 2 cents.
Well I was referring to the topic. You can disagree, of course, it's okay, I just wrote down my point of view. I think that "impossible" is wrong and that telemetry is overall not an argument, as already pointed out you can reduce the telemetry in Windows and there are btw also distros with telemetry too e.g. Ubuntu [but you can fully opt-out/opt-in]. I'm not sure why you guys come up with Google etc, that's off-topic. The reference is only relevant for the telemetry point but that's all. It's not that Google and MS did not already helped to "make the web more secure", so not everything they do is bad. You're never too old to learn new tricks my friend. I think the main problem is as said "control" and that some people have a biased opinion on the OS. It's not hard to make the switch, it will take some time to get familiar with the internals but I think it's worth it.
hm. i did not ask for telemetry, and it was just shoved down my throat in w7 although i did not use the `free` update for w 10.and easily? did they include an opt-out for w7, then? they just kept changing ip-adresses loaded with that garbage,and off topic, google?they got fined by eu, and by to looks of it they do not give a damn. that is not off-topic, it is just big companies misbehaving, i think.and that includes canonical with ubuntu too. i am afraid we have to agree to disagree there, like on your #1280 post.
No, the entire "telemetry" scandal is because you CANNOT fully opt-out. Because some KB's automatically (even under Windows 7) introducing or resetting telemetry (an OS upgrade via in-place upgrade also resets everything) and even if you disable everything it was proven multiple times that Windows still sends something back for "security reasons". Yes, MS still has to solve this and I hope they get punished by DSGVO/GDPR for this. Yen posted in the telemetry thread the domains which are still been connected after you set everything to level 0 (security, on LTSC). There are other reports for Windows 7... So this is not a Windows 10 only problem. On Ubuntu, you can opt-out and then nothing gets transmitted, which is not the best (opt-in should be preferred) but you at least see nothing gets transmitted. The strange thing is that MS contradicts themselves, new products like MS Edge (Chromium) having also telemetry but there you need to opt-in by default which is fine too me. You can, as said reduce the telemetry and block the rest via firewall, but a normal user simply does not mess with KB's and installs every KB or does not know how to block some domains via hosts etc and that's what MS "abuses" here. Again Linux is already fine, it has its problems too but there are other problems mostly like drivers (I do not blame Linux for this btw). But overall you know when you install Linux, you know that the OS "is yours" and that you're in control. Please guys keep the focus on Linux, it's so underestimated and such a good product which is worth millions of dollars. I think there is nothing wrong with at least giving it a try.
The biggie for many folks is that no matter which other word processing or spreadsheet apps they prefer, they find that to share files with many other folks they get FORCED to deal with DOCX & XLSX files - so as CK points out here: Even for that problem there is a superb solution under Linux in the form of Freeoffice from Softmaker. I agree 100% with Nodnar here: If just by how M$ openly stole most of their add-ons way back in the days of DOS, which they then sold as 'updates' and 'upgrades' to the gullible & ignorant masses, at huge profits thereby. Again - I agree that this problem is a matter of removing CHOICES: Which seems to be the 'new M$ paradigm' with all their baloney OSes released from XP onwards. I admit openly to my very strong bias in regards to the following, BUT ALSO: M$ regards its users as gullible & controllable morons - vs. Linux (on the whole) which works very well for those who are willing to use their brains - a little self-motivation - and any small capacity to adjust in order to keep their choices as their OWN. Once again I also say this for the M$ adherents: For anyone who remains firmly convinced that for them - the ONLY things that are willing accept come from M$ - then great - stick with it & I do sincerely compliment you on your dedication !! For other folks, especially those who are already Linux users via their smartphones anyhow - the move can be easy & painless & especially if one has a friend or three who are already Linux users & are willing to lend a hand. (And even without any outside help, getting a liveboot going is trivial for most folks nowadays.) As to myself specifically=> I have spent ~32 years (so far...) supporting all sorts of users starting with DOS on monochrome screens & sticking with that work actively including positively stopping all forward movements of M$ OS releases after XP for those whom I assist. Given my fairly lengthy perspective - I say without hesitation that PCs categorically have not changed radically since the days of the 8086 - because what people need to do with them has not changed so very much. Sure, they are faster, more graphically oriented - and all too easily confused with TVs now, BUT: Until our households are actively managed (if ever...) by a truly benevolent AI, with holographic telepresence that we are able to reach out to from wherever we may be (harmlessly !!) - then PCs are just devices that make documents for us, allow us forms of communication, and all too often now (IMO) - provide entertainments. Convergence has happened already - and most folks are blissfully unaware that they are living in a time period in which there is rampant confusion between all the screens they are surrounded with pretty much 24/7 already. Very soon I will be able to say that all the folks who are either clients or friends will have Linux based PCs for their daily uses - with and/or without VMs to keep some older apps & all with WINE + variants in order to use some win32 stuff directly & easily. The most recent addition is a current model, 17" HP branded notebook PC purchased at a wonderfully low price via seasonal sale - which will have Linux on it after never even booting into that abortion called '10' - which I will eviscerate without the attendant sufferings forced upon the users by even starting it for the very 1st time - no thanks, I say !! Life is about choices - whether made consciously or simply by default - and my choices in this are to use & support Linux. Impossible for MOST ?? Not even remotely close - and that wording as a thread title has been misleading folks from when it 1st got posted here - just as all good propaganda aims to do.
I'm relatively new to this forum, I only joined to get KMS stuff. So my take is this : I don't care a jot about Windows 10 spyware, as I only ever use it for gaming and it is completely offline. No antivirus. No network. Simple. All of my network life is conducted in linux. If I need a windows file, I download it in linux, and access it (read-only) using ext2fsd, if dual booting, or via sftp from another machine. My main daily work systems are linux, Ubuntu Mate LTS at present. I'll probably upgrade from 18.04.3 to 20.04 in the spring. The truth is, we don't actually want a deluge of hapless Windows users invading the calm waters of linux. The profane and unwashed can stick with their Windows. When is the Year of the Linux Desktop ? NEVER ! is my vote
Sorry to say Briankemp=> I just added 3 more windows refugees to the Linux user ranks, but - will they ever 'invade' anything, anyplace demanding answers to stupid questions ?? Nope. It is my place to answer and/or fulfill their needs - and another several will soon follow, adding to the ranks of those whom I brought into a better IT world. Ubuntu Mate LTS makes for an excellent desktop replacement that such users can just slide right into, painlessly. So I reply here: Too late my friend, you must have missed the memo, because that came some years back - actually a bit before veester did a great job of scaring folks away from winblows - which win-ache (8) & ache.one pushed ever harder before winblows 10 really did the trick. Of course this also ignores the uncountable millions (billions by now ??) of actively in-use Android devices which folks think are good enough to totally replace their PCs. The only force working against this tide is the M$ embrace-extend-extinguish campaign - about which only time will tell. Back to the end users I just added to the ranks of Linux users before I close my reply: They are delighted to have NEITHER the costs of s/w nor the stupefaction & hassles of the latest, 'modern' winblows.
Linux: - FOSS - Less resources because it loads less - Almost all apps which are trustworthy are FOSS (not all but there are FOSS alternatives). - Gaming is possible on Linux too, it might require more steps to actually get the game working but it will run, the stuff which isn't running is a publisher "problem", license problem or the game just wasn't ported to an API which runs on Linux the same as under Windows. - Almost every super-computer runs on Linux because you can customize the OS how you want. - Strong user-base same like on Windows. - Some Linux distros have controversial functions too, however due to open source you can re-compile it how you want. - Android is based on Linux (kernel) and Android itself runs on "a lot" of devices, no one actually uses MS Windows "mobile OS" because it's terrible. Windows: - Closed source (some parts are might going to be opened e.g. MS Edge (Chromium), .NET Framework etc) - No transparency (or less) - Pointless "change logs" provided from MS which overall says nothing, verification isn't possible because you need to reverse and decompile everything and then you're not permitted to post it in public because MS owns the rights. - MS tries to push more and more open source with more or less success, they even copy Linux functions like "bash" - Similar like on Linux, the driver performance depends on how well the driver was written and tested. - Windows is in no aspect better than Linux but the problem is that some OEM's refuse to open their drivers, firmwares etc. Which means they might (from a non developer perspective) be designed to run more performant on Windows or are simply "Windows only" - MS has proven multiple times that they screwed up when it comes to user data privacy, this might actually could have been prevented if they just leaked the code or excluded critical features like telemetry. It's proven that MS telemetry data collection didn’t help to improve the OS, same like NSA admitted that pointless data-collection doesn't make you "all knowledgeable". You need to understand how to correctly interpret the data and how to correctly use them, MS simply has no real concept on how to collect data to improve the entire OS and user are still forced to use platforms like reddit, ms own forums to provide "some useful feedback". MS own feedback program is entirely based on "user input". Linux is already better in every way. In Windows you're not even permitted to change the desktop how you want, you need "illegal" workarounds like themserv.dll patches and whatnot. On Linux you can just tweak it how you want (this is of course only one example of many). Why people are still forced to use Windows - Some s**thead OEM's making exclusive deals with MS - Some s**thead vendors refuse to open source their tools - Some s**thead developer studios refuse to use open source API's and even then Linux provides emulation via WINE etc. That speaks for Linux and against developer studios which are too ignorant to use "modern" and FOSS alternatives. - No one needs telemetry, not in Windows nor in Linux (Ubuntu). - The main problem is that there exist FOSS alternatives for basically everything, but some people simply refuse the possibility to switch to it, nothing will change that unless people are going to wake up and do not support this behavior, just do not buy games which are not running on all platforms., same goes of course for applications, this way you also have the potability to switch to every OS you want and you know your app/game works there too. Is Linux to blame? Hell no!
there is probably lot of views i want to tell but maybe later. generally saying i favor open source philosophy and i am convinced that open source software is way to go for most cases. android is one black sheep in my view. reality is that most android devices have google closed source software in it, therefore this bundle is shortly saying worse than windows. two to mention, google play and google play services. in my view google is worse than microsoft and google controls android too much. some linux supporters brag about how usage of android helps linux. i don't belong to this club. google abuses linux for their own benefit.
Yeah, you're overall right, however that's a vendor thing. They must be forced to show their modifications, sadly they don't do it and including their own apps and modification into the OS without that you can review it. Huawei among others are now for example forced (due to antitrust) to open their 5G source, because the times to blindly trust vendors is (thankfully) over (btw this 5G example doesn't mean the source is been public available but the government gets it to review and approve it). We see that closed source doesn't even hold, e.g. on Apple iOS the new exploit for root was found and leaked, Apple years ago argued that they didn't fully open it because of root, manipulations etc.but at the end you can never prevent anything, people will find a way around. The biggest problem is that people steal your code but that's the only argument you can find, but this not affects Microsoft since they own now GitHub and basically can control every other repo if they want to. MS (in my point of view) should be forced to release the source code incl. all apps etc and only should permit opening source the kernel to the government. This way you can be sure no backdoor/spyware etc is included (of course you have to trust the gov and what they say about their audit, but that's another topic).
Most of the apps should be released as open source in the Windows SDK, so that they can be used to help app developers to write better code. But then, you'd get to see how MS has an unfair advantage over -every- Windows app developer. And how they break their own rules with regards to coding. "Do as I say...Not as I do."
"Do what you think you should/wants to do, but not what they are told you to do", that's change the "point of view".
(UN-)Affectionately also known as the 'wintel cartel' for decades: Given that intuit, apple and numerous other very popular trade names are also m$ properties (covertly if need be...), those folks need never be concerned about running out of easy, ready cash flow.
hmm many times I think we here from MDL we are also in a way we are guinea pig too I feel it's been a long time...