Crayolaeater, I found your mention of that PC to be very helpful because I didn't know a brand name to search on before & I've wanted to see what such sellers were up to - so thanks for that !! It seems most likely to me - having supported a great many users of all ages, that with the kind of customers the Wow type of folks get, there is likely no more than 30 questions asked of them 99% of the time - so they likely outsourced it in the cheapest ways possible & actually make a bundle on it. Also, if/when any query falls above the 30 question list - they can assuredly get away with charging extra for 'high level support' for that crowd. As for 'normal' & familiar - for anyone who was a user of XP & earlier windoze - all that came after it is utterly alien & far more upsetting than the transition to a more familiar Linux distro, I have found - and also as you so wisely said, when presented with Linux instead of the newest mikr0$0ft abortions, most users I've known are puzzled only because it is NOT so different than what they prefer. Ipx: In a user friendliness thread (IMO) - I would avoid any mention of Arch and especially any perversion of Linux associated with the wintel cartel. The 1st because it is not advantageous for folks looking to make the transition - the 2nd simply because their bread & butter is windoze, so no good can come of it. Having looked at both of those options - the 2nd is utterly dismissed vs. the 1st - which even at its easiest will not make for happy users who are just starting off, probably about 99% of the times. My goal in making this thread is to help & encourage aspiring Linux users - NOT to mislead or hopelessly confuse them !!
Dear, Wonderful, Endlessly Disagreeable ipx. Looks like you are here only to create discomfort with insults towards others - reminds me of some angry teenagers whom I've known...thank goodness they eventually matured & nobody strangled them !! Perhaps you are bosom buddies with steveinwa at the Obi forum ?? If not, you'd surely admire him as he seems to spend many hours coming up with ways to post unhelpful replies AND insult people all at once. Regarding this thread that I started in hopes of helping & encouraging aspiring Linux users: - To start with, it has gotten over 1000 views no matter how many active users here have replied to it; - I made the thread, you are not the boss of me, and if you think maybe you are - I suggest herding cats for a more likely to suceed hobby for you; - In the past I have posted about what I call 'grandpa friendly' - which is actually how I view the need for user friendliness when it comes to Linux distros - my own measure - yours of course differs as with all things. You disagree (of course...) - so post your own thread and disagree there with anyone who may join you. I wish you well and sincerely hope that for your own well being that you will not become like this guy: *removed* Best Wishes for a Happy Life to You ipx !!
And...regarding the need to 'win' arguments online in general: ... removed by ancestor(v)... OK, you win - no contest was intended by me, but all the same, I declare you the WINNER !! (Hopefully that gives you warm fuzzies to know - you've won, YAY !!)
Now, perhaps the wonderfully helpful & kind folks who have added real value to this & other threads may resume adding real value here without any needs to avoid insults like the lightly disguised one posted in the desktop environment thread...aimed at a fellow member's perfectly good choice of a classic desktop configuration.
There was mention in another thread (I've forgotten which) of someone who could not install Linux due to the h/w limitations which pretty much persisted no matter what (something to do with the word 'cow' IIRC ?!?). I could not find that specific thread, but here will do for mentioning some illuminating info that I ran across today, which I posted about, here: https://forums.mydigitallife.net/th...le-for-many-people.78605/page-13#post-1632778
Hello @smallhagrid - In regards to certain hardware causing problems with Linux and UEFI boot, I came across an HP white paper several years ago that explained why I had so many problems with my HP laptop. Ever since the introduction of Windows 8 and UEFI boot, HP saw fit to only use two specific boot paths and two specific filenames in order to boot their UEFI machines. They are: With Secure Boot enabled, using Microsoft's digitally signed bootloader file: ESP\Microsoft\boot\bootmgfw.efi With Secure Boot disabled, using the generic bootloader file: ESP\EFI\boot\bootx64.efi One workaround for Linux on an HP machine (which is a bit of a kludge) is to "trick" the machine's UEFI firmware into accepting the Linux bootloader file in place of the Windows bootloader file. You can do this by 1.) Rename (Don't Delete!!!) the Windows bootloader file (i.e. use Xbootmgfw.efi). 2.) Rename the Linux bootloader file "shimx64.efi" as "bootmgfw.efi". 3.) Place it in the folder in the path ESP\Microsoft\boot. NOTE: Major updates to Windows (i.e. upgrading Windows 10 to newer build) have been known to break this workaround. Like I said, it's a kludge, not a true solution to the problem.
Great info John Sutherland !! It may be very helpful to many folks here who prefer that sort of situation. Just as a sort of side-note: I have done a goodly batch of HP PCs & my solution has simply been to do away with all vestiges of everything & to start with a 100% blank slate. That is less helpful info than what you've provided as it is certain that many folks would be afraid of doing that & might even desire to keep the originally shipped OS in place for dual-booting or as a sort of 'security blanket'. (I don't even boot those HP PCs into the shipped OS before cleaning all that cruft out...as it makes for even more lingering problems I have found.) As I do it... Changing the BIOS settings 1st to eliminate the underlying irritants, and then=> Booting directly into GParted or PartedMagic to clean up the rest delivers the blank slate for me very well.