Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency Technologies

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Satoshi Nakamoto, Mar 1, 2016.

  1. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

    Jan 12, 2012
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    The problem with block chain is.... well it is virtual, there's really no real substance behind it except for algorithms. I mean if it were back by a gold standard then that would have much more to it
     
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  2. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #82 Yen, Sep 6, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018
    Yes. The countermeasure is a healthy competition, though. And antitrust laws. Also monopolies are harmful.
    To make money credit card companies and the issuing banks need customers to make money.

    Either I get more customers offering good conditions, better than another competitor (healthy) OR there is usury either way and the customers have no other choice (sick)....

    I have chosen a bank where I have got my Visa with good conditions. I am glad there are still banks trying to get customers offering good deals....


    A bank account with systematic bank account number BIC and IBAN and stuff is as virtual!!!

    It's a way of thinking..but only because BTCs seemingly do not exist as 'real money' the blockchain (BC) is as virtual as your bank account.

    The cool thing is the BC can be stored on everybody's drive. It has no owner and it holds any relation forever and is not manipulable. It is actually a X/Y assignment.

    BTC address X holds Y coins. Owner of the coins is the one who has the private key to the public key = BTC address of the Blockchain.
    The BC is just a serial database which stores the changes of the X/Y assignments.

    When you create a wallet you create a few private/public key pairs, that's all. There is nothing in the BC yet...
    If you want now BTCs you have to tell us one of your public key = BTC address.

    When I'd send you BTCs it just would lower the corresponding Y value of my address and yours would increase (simplified...... there can be change addresses as well). And these new values are then stored in the BC and your public address appears the first time there.

    If you lose the corresponding private key the corresponding BTCs (yours) will remain in the BC forever. Without any ownership that could be regained. :) No government ever!


    Now compare that to common bank account number..which is X and the amount of money is Y.
    And imagine one would deny that you are being its owner.....(government for instance)?!
    Or somebody wants to seize it....
    Do you really 'own' X and by that its amount?

    X/Y pairs are plain and strict. The one who has got the private key to X owns Y. And only the one who has got it has access to Y!!!

    That is full own control and responsibility of it....
     
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  3. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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    Governments will always try to seek control....
    Odds are that Bitcoin will be regulated at some point in the future
     
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  4. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
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    True. And True.

    Every government will try to do what's in the best interests of their own economy. That calls for regulation on an international level.
     
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  5. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #85 Yen, Sep 7, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2018
    'They' want to and they will try it...and they are doing it already....

    With current specifications of the BC they only can do that at the 'interfaces'.
    When you open an online account at a bank that deals BTCs you have to identify yourself completely already here. And all your private keys are actually contolled by them. Sure they are encrypted but stored on their servers. They are associated to your login account.
    But there are private wallets and clients such as Electrum.

    I could buy BTCs privately. Just telling a BTC address that belongs to me paying cash and returning BTCs.

    One also can print vouchers with a certain amount of own BTCs on it. A QR code with fancy design.
    Once scanned and imported the amount of BTCs gets subtracted from my wallet and added to the other one.
    It's obvious that 'printing own money' can be a thorn in their side.

    *I also could go to a BTC ATM. Entering a BTC address of mine, choosing the amount of BTCs and pay with Visa (Euros). By doing that the BTC address gets a relation to my Visa identity, though. (Interface that can be controlled).

    The interfaces that can be controlled are there because buying means exchanging. And by doing that an identity can be associated.
    To avoid that one of course uses one BTC address only for one recipience and simply creates more and more. :) Nobody knows about your own pool of addresses.

    And the addition to my previous post what I have simplified. (selling / buying process at the BC)

    What is a unit? "One bank note"? Denomination.
    At $ and € and other currencies "real money" we have fixed coins / banknotes. 5,10,20,50,100,200,500 or whatever.

    At BTCs one address is one unit! It took several hours until I got that, LOL when I got interested in BTCs. It can have any value, though.

    Let's say one BTC address holds 0.3 BTCs. Then you have got ONE unit denomination 0.3.
    You cannot pay another certain amount with it!

    If you have to pay 0.25 you have to give away your 0.3 "banknote" as a whole and return 0.05 as change. To prevent a relation of seller/buyer, the change should return to another BTC address of yours. Bitcoin wallets such as Electrum are using change addresses per default.
    If you have more than 0.3 BTC to pay then it uses the lower value addresses first to have them blank.
    BTC addresses are used starting by the one with the lowest amount until the sum exceeds the amount you have to pay the first time. Goal is to get as many blank as possible when you pay.

    I am curious what will happen and how they go on to control more
     
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  6. ds1991

    ds1991 MDL Novice

    Feb 16, 2017
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    It's inevitable, but what's more concerning is the move to a totally digital currency, which is certainly coming.
    Tinfoil hat time:
    Once 'cash' is eradicated and the only means of exchange is a digital currency, a universal Worldwide currency similar to Bitcoin, it gives total control to the banks and governments, this means every transaction can tracked, traced.
    You could even argue Bitcoin is a social experiment to get a generation used to a Digital currency before Cash is eradicated and a regulated cryptocurrency controlled by the IMF is implemented.
    Governments have always done things this way, they have done it with the Internet, anyone old enough who was online 20 years ago will know there was everything available, free, music/video/software/pornography/information etc but look what has happened in a generation, iTunes, Netflix, (subscription services) - all banking and most shopping done online,legislation passed which means you can go to prison for posting an opinion on Twitter or forums gets shut down under the term 'hate-speech' or 'trolling' or 'terrorism', and just now Article 3, 4, 11, 13 & 15 are being proposed in the EU
    Millennials have grown up in this environment and now see it as 'normal'
     
  7. do you believe in time travel? :)

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1lfobc/i_am_a_timetraveler_from_the_future_here_to_beg/
     
  8. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
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    :laie:

    Great story.
     
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  9. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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  10. ancestor(v)

    ancestor(v) Admin
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    https://www.deepdotweb.com/2018/10/...tag-to-monitor-sales-on-darknet-marketplaces/

    https://www.crisp-da.de/en/research...]=show&cHash=045e8593d145c014c66dc83855c5e133

    https://www.researchgate.net/public...aracterizing_payments_among_men_with_no_names
     
  11. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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  12. Yen

    Yen Admin
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  13. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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    IMHO, a certain amount of theft and slippage is to be expected with any new technology, especially one that deals with currency.
    We can only hope that the security holes are found by "white hat" people and are reported accordingly.
     
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  14. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #95 Yen, Oct 30, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2018
    It's not sure if it was rather a scam....

    IMHO it's about responsibility. We know MDL has been hacked by a destructive individual and I'd say the MDL team is skilled and has applied anything important, anyway it's happened.
    MDL has valuable contents but no virtual currencies stored.

    I could not open an online platform for people who want to store their BTCs on my server. I cannot take that responsibility TBH.
    Small platforms are on focus of scammers / hackers and to have the private certificates there remotely accessible is a reason alone not to take the responsibility.

    I am not familiar with current technologies of such platforms, though.
    Anyway a secure system should not unveil the private keys when hacked either way.

    The concept to have stored the private keys on the server-side is generally questionable.

    Well 913 BTCs were not manny a few years ago. But the potential for an attack increases with higher BTC rates....

    Having BTCs alone at home -offline- is much safer, IMHO.
    And the idea of a seed is very nice..just a few words in a row authorize me as their owner...-offline-
     
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  15. #96 Deleted member 1158084, Nov 6, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 15, 2018
    (OP)
    BITCOIN CASH

    In October 2008, Satoshi Nakamoto published the famous whitepaper entitled “Bitcoin: A Peer to Peer Electronic Cash System”. In 2009, he released the first bitcoin software that powered the network, and it operated smoothly for several years with low fees, and fast, reliable transactions.

    Unfortunately, from 2016 to 2017, Bitcoin became increasingly unreliable and expensive. This was because the community could not reach consensus on increasing the network capacity. Some of the developers did not understand and agree with Satoshi's plan. Instead, they preferred Bitcoin become a settlement layer.

    By 2017, Bitcoin dominance had plummeted from 95% to as low as 40% as a direct result of the usability problems. Fortunately, a large portion of the Bitcoin community, including developers, investors, users, and businesses, still believed in the original vision of Bitcoin -- a low fee, peer to peer electronic cash system that could be used by all the people of the world.

    On August 1st, 2017, we took the logical step of increasing the maximum block size, and Bitcoin Cash was born. Anyone who held Bitcoin at that time (block 478558) became an owner of Bitcoin Cash (BCH). The network now supports up to 32MB blocks with ongoing research to allow massive future increases.

    On November 15, 2018 at 17:40 there is a conflict between Bitcoin Cash development communities which may result in a chain split which may result in Bitcoin Cash ABC and Bitcoin Cash SV.

    A penny for your thoughts.;)

    https://www.ccn.com/bitcoin-cash-hard-fork-how-did-we-get-here

    https://www.investopedia.com/news/all-about-bitcoin-cash-hard-fork

    4 Yen:
    https://www.btc-echo.de/der-bitcoin-cash-buergerkrieg-abc-vs-sv

    https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Showdown-bei-Bitcoin-Cash-Kampf-bis-zum-Tod-4222197.html

    https://www.presseportal.de/pm/132800/4116788




     
  16. ralphbryant

    ralphbryant MDL Novice

    May 15, 2019
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    well i think the value it get is because of a hype created over the years and they are continuously trying to convience people that it is the future of currency
     
  17. MS_User

    MS_User MDL Guru

    Nov 30, 2014
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    bitcoins virtual money is a fad that will disappear i dont see a future in that...but i get the concept of it and the benefits of uncentralized money that no one owns and u can buy with out leaving a trace....but i could be wrong so many bitcoins believers invest hundreds of thousands of dollars in mining rigs thinking it will pay off in the long run.
     
  18. v.barki

    v.barki MDL Novice

    Dec 24, 2018
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    How can i sell my Bitcoin in Inda
     
  19. Quo Vadis

    Quo Vadis MDL Junior Member

    Sep 1, 2019
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    By finding a local dealer on a marketplace like Localbitcoins.com and buying bitcoins from them with cash, credit card, via PayPal, etc. By buying or selling goods or services for bitcoins. How to buy or sell bitcoin in India using an exchange: Binance, Coinbase, HitBTC, Changelly, CEX.IO, Coinmama.

    see: https://cryptonews.com/guides/how-to-buy-and-sell-bitcoin-in-india.htm

    Greetings from Satoshi Nakamoto