Coronavirus | Discussion

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Deleted member 1254778, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. Yen

    Yen Admin (retired)
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    #3941 Yen, Jan 31, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2022
    Stop talking about dogma while you are insisting on your narrative.:D

    This is a Swedish newspaper that links to official stats
    https://www.thelocal.se/20220108/in...n-during-pandemic-now-among-lowest-in-europe/

    IN NUMBERS: Excess mortality in Sweden during pandemic now lower than most in Europe

    I am glad that you yourself came up with excess deaths. (Übersterblichkeit)
    If I had done that myself you would have said this number says nothing.

    And here: Saying the LOWEST in Europe 2021
    https://exxpress.at/schweden-hat-europaweit-die-geringste-uebersterblichkeit/

    [​IMG]




    No sorry, everybody can see it now. You are ridiculing yourself!
     
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  2. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    I believe, not sure, we (wife, daughter and I) got covid Omicron variant lol

    The night before last night I woke up at 3 am with strong headache thinking it was my benzobrain condition although I don't really suffer headaches other than brain pressure (not the same).

    I couldn't sleep rest of the night. In the morning they told me of a strong headache.

    Me and wife no fever but I started showing lung constipation, a bit, along with oxygen desaturation, a bit, I don't have an oxymeter at hand. Daughter with a bit of fever no axygen issues, wife no lung issues but they both strong headache as well. That's why I believe we caught Omicron.

    Therapy: chlorine dioxide CDS, Ivermectin, Aspirin, Ibuprofen .

    Yay, we're doing good...
     
  3. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #3943 gorski, Jan 31, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2022
    @Yen, I certainly do not have a "narrative", unlike you, as anyone can see now... I am interested in anything but dogma! Unlike you, for a while now... Sadly... I insist on DATA and you are insisting on only those bits of data that suit your narrative! A dogmatic narrative! A prearranged goal that must be justified with all means at your disposal, tunnel vision and all...

    And your last post is total rubbish!!! It says "NOW" (sic!!!). Get a grip, man! They allowed most of their old and infirm, susceptible to the virus to be culled, i.e. most of their "balast" is gone and you think that this is the reason to CELEBRATE?!? Who here is RIDICULOUS?!?

    This is the REAL DEAL, the REAL DATA re. their death rate per million in comparison to their neighbours:

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/

    Characteristic Confirmed cases (absolute) Cases in last 7 days Confirmed deaths (absolute) Deaths in last 7 days Daily increase (# deaths) Population (in millions) Deaths per million (total) Deaths per million (last 7 days)

    Sweden 1,973,485 231,775 15,674 137 75 10.29 1,523.9 13.32
    Denmark¹ 1,504,724 253,064 3,600 104 21 5.82 618.71 17.87
    Finland 371,135 0 1,724 0 0 5.52 312.3 0
    Norway 690,244 118,589 1,414 26 23 5.35 264.4 4.86

    Sorry but it is quite obvious to anyone now that your picking and choosing ONLY the bits that fit your dogmatic narrative is anything but scientific!!!

    Chew on that piece of evidence... Sweden is best! Sure, in allowing a cull of its old, infirm and so on... And it is not the first time they were involved in such unsavoury, eugenics-like policies on the level of the state...

    One hoped they were finally over it, that they have learnt their lesson but this is obviously not possible! Every generation has to re-learn that for themselves and this one certainly hasn't yet!!!
     
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  4. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #3944 gorski, Jan 31, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2022
    Look, let me break it down for anyone who does not know...

    There is an article in the Newsweek attacking Fauci for "deflecting the blame" etc.

    https://www.newsweek.com/dr-fauci-c...sFkSDjMd20Ksixd0rTmP83m76kTEm7PJBWNdxhMWwpppA

    Well, this is rather naff from their side... They are "ridiculing" Fauci as somebody who is "deflecting blame" (while he was simply a part of the huge chunk of the scientific community and a part of the team, of course) - and what are they doing now?!? By their own "logic" they are doing precisely what they are blaming Fauci for: "deflecting the blame", by saying "Oh, look, it wasn't us, it was them"...

    Yes, it was "them" (CDC, Fauci and co.) who saved millions of lives, otherwise it would have been much worse (at least with the original Wuhan strain and Delta), had it not been for vaccinations and measures! I mean, what are they talking about here - what was the alternative? "Targeted minority" to be protected and the rest should have gone about their business as before - but how is that actually, practically possible?

    And what we actually have here is essentially a tiny minority of libertarians and conservatives who have picked a fight with majority who did see that this was about solidarity, empathy, the Hippocratic oath ("Do no harm!") and even at a rock bottom level of nothing more than basic self-interest (no one knows how one shall react to the pathogen!) this is an enlightened self-interest based policy that did not sacrifice the old, infirm and susceptible to the virus AND it did not play Russian roulette with one's own life or health or that of their families etc.

    Where was all this "push them all back to work" coming from (even while the pandemic was at its deadliest swing)?!?

    I'll remind those of you who forgot and I shall inform those of you who simply do not know: Koch Industries through their think-tanks - safely barricaded behind their heavy doors, insisting in internal memos to "stay at home out of abundance of precaution" - at the same time levied quite a bit of pressure on the Congress etc. to push all of those "less fortunate" back to work!!!

    Here, inform yourselves properly, if you are interested in truth of the matter at hand, as in "whose interest was it to go back to work" regardless of the warnings coming from a huge majority of scientific and medical community:

    https://theintercept.com/2020/03/26...GcP0Q67k26PIaPvZVSGTFiQHp8WNnbLLj29i8ZiVvRgxQ

    March 2020:

    "CHARLES KOCH NETWORK PUSHED $1 BILLION CUT TO CDC, NOW ATTACKS SHELTER-IN-PLACE POLICIES FOR HARMING BUSINESS
    Americans for Prosperity, a pro-corporate group, wants employees to return to work despite desperate pleas from public health officials to the contrary."

    They told each other "Don't be a fool, stay at home, we are not going out there, it's too dangerous!"

    So, I don't know about you but I am NOT going to be fooled by THEM!!!

    P.S. One more thing: I know of a time when biggest industrialists ended up in bed with Nazi-Fascists. It is happening, quite clearly, nowadays, on this particular issue! I would be VERY careful who I'd be planting such poisonous fruits with...
     
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  5. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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  6. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    #3946 Mr.X, Jan 31, 2022
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2022


    This is so cool



    Justin Trudeau, that rat fled to an undisclosed location lol
     
  7. Palladin

    Palladin MDL Senior Member

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  8. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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  9. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Hopefully, all this is coming to a close, at least when it comes to huge numbers, lots of people dead or severely affected by C-19... However...

    We shall have to deal with this, methinx: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/feb/01/children-long-covid-coronavirus

    ‘The scariest thing’: the children living with long Covid
    Though still rare, the numbers of kids across the US reporting symptoms long after infection are increasing, doctors say

    And we shall be able to compare, if not perfectly: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/01/cuba-leads-world-vaccinating-children

    Cuba leads the world in vaccinating children as young as two against Covid
    With confidence in public health system high, 95% of kids aged 2-18 are fully vaccinated and Omicron infection rates are low

    "The Swedes have rejected it, Dr Fauci says the US may soon approve it, the Chinese have started, but the Cubans have already vaccinated almost all young children against Covid.

    The island is the only country vaccinating toddlers as young as two against the disease, and more than 95% of two- to 18-year-olds have now been fully vaccinated, according to the ministry of public health.

    “Although Covid hits children less severely, they are an important factor in transmission,” said Dr Gerardo Guillén, the lead developer of Abdala, one of the island’s homegrown vaccines.

    Child vaccination, one of the world’s highest Covid vaccination rates and high herd immunity after a massive Delta peak last summer, he said, have contributed to significantly lower infection rates in Cuba than in the US and Europe throughout the Omicron wave."

    Let's see, in a year or three, who got it right...
     
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  10. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Hey! @Yen
    How you doing?
    How do you feel in this journey?
    Great awakening isn't it?
    Medical and scientific institutions are not what they look correct?
    :D
     
  11. Yen

    Yen Admin (retired)
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    #3951 Yen, Feb 2, 2022
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2022
    You still are and you do not stop. You are even going the extra mile.
    And you can keep your classification of individuals like me into a political direction.

    To say Sweden did it best can be reasoned by their lowest of all EU nations excess mortality 2021, for instance.

    "Here we deploy "excess death" measurement, to see the difference that C-19 brings into the equation! "Then, we have to formulate a Public Health Policy! Not from a prejudiced position! But after looking at data! In an unprejudiced manner!"

    .....then you saw that the numbers do not feed your narrative ooops...and then you repeated posting the died from / with COVID numbers.

    If you should have a problem that the excess death map is per 100,000 then add a zero digit each 20/100,000 = 200/1,000,000
    This is maths of a 10 year old, it's called "to expand a fraction".

    Your definition of real = fits to personal narrative. This is the same definition the politicians have.
    BOTH numbers are real! Your numbers posted (died from / with COVID positive) and mine posted (excess deaths).
    Sweden has lowest excess mortality which indicates that their overall management is best.

    And nothing else I have said. You yourself suggested that number of excess deaths to be deployed! And yes it is reasonable to do so. :thumbsup:

    The excess deaths already take into account that the died from / with COVID number also contain fatalities which are not causal to COVID19 alone otherwise Sweden would not have the lowest excess death rate of those EU nations.
    I pointed on that by illustrating how numbers change when doing a more specific DB query "with no underlying causes ".


    Oh yes. :)
    But finally rationality and real science will succeed. I hope it will initiate a complete structural change at those institutions.

    And also the political corona narrative is starting to collapse here in Germany. (Vaccine mandates based on illusions).

    But what's hard to resolve (from the Covid-19 vaccines and treatments: we must have raw data, now) BMJ article.

    Well said here at the BMJ!


    BTW I put here some patents (Matrix adjuvant), Novavax...got some help from colleges finding them. :)

    I'll edit this post and add comments on them as soon as I have more time
    https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/7c/35/95/17975866117fee/US7838019.pdf
    https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/5e/85/70/6d122cd390b815/US9205147.pdf
    https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/66/1a/9f/4140097f315580/US9901634.pdf
    https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/0b/f1/8e/e76f32f75d365f/US8821881.pdf


    Some of them are interesting.
    Especially the technical process. It's the same and kind of funny I am doing in the lab ATM......

    It's preparative HPLC. But I am not isolating Quillaja Saponins.

    I am purifying a synthesized metabolite of something (NDA). :cool:
     
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  12. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #3952 gorski, Feb 2, 2022
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2022
    @Yen, this IS POLITICAL!!! Only you don't see it! You choose not to see it! (That's why the option you prefer is championed by AfD, FCOL!!! You should be a bit more careful than to end up in bed with such lot!!! Don't tell me you haven't noticed it - the company you're in now...)

    Besides,I gave you the DATA and what do you do? Like a good old dogmatic scholastic - you ignore the relevant data! RIDICULOUS for a scientists!!! I mean, gimme a break here, this is too ridiculous for words!!! I wiped the floor with your "vision" of C-19 pandemic and what needs to be done by using your "best example"! They are amongst the WORST examples overall!!! They can NOT brag about all those deaths!!! In fact, they should be ashamed of themselves, killing so many people needlessly! Of course they now have low excess deaths - AFTER THEY ALLOWED SO MANY OLD AND WEAK, VULNERABLE HUMAN BEINGS DIE NEEDLESSLY!!! But that is something to ASHAMED OF, FFS!!!

    Moreover, this never was and never will be "scientific debate only"! You are in PUBLIC HEALTH POLICY TERRITORY and that is much more my turf, if you want to put it that way! We are not talking NUMBERS but HUMAN HEALTH and HUMAN LIVES!!! But you just do not want to understand it as it would ruin your karma or something... In your own words, now your 'ego' is speaking despite the facts!!!

    In Croatia, Bosnia, Bulgaria and so on (the Balkans generally) the C-19 related deaths are worse than ever! What do you have to say about that? See the data!! I dare you! Go on, enlighten us...
     
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  13. vladnil

    vladnil MDL Senior Member

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    2022-02-02_212436.jpg 2022-02-02_212833.jpg

    How old is Soros?
    Probably 300 years old?
    Has he had more than one heart transplant and other organs?
    George Soros is a Lego set :)
     
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  14. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Wow! What a company to keep... Vladnil for Pres!
     
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  15. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    :eek:

    This is outrageous.
    I don't know in your respective countries but in mine this is an humiliation, a rudeness beyond acceptable for a forum authority.

    This insect is sending a very negative message to everybody regardless whether he's right or not.

    I Can't believe this, @Yen
     
  16. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    He can believe it from an arse-licker, sure he can...

    Btw, no arguments whatsoever, just pleading with those droopy kitty eyes, looking upwards (hat in hand, covering the boots), towards the authority - really shows right through you, X...

    Back to basics...
    Covid-19 in the UK
    72.3% with two vaccine doses and 55.7% with booster top-up

    Daily cases
    88,085
    -14,207 v last week

    In hospital
    15,233
    -1,417 v last week

    Daily deaths
    534
    +188 v last week


    Cases and deaths as published on 2 Feb, hospital numbers on 1 Feb. Vaccine % is total population with two or three doses on 1 Feb. Source: PHE.
     
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  17. Yen

    Yen Admin (retired)
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    #3958 Yen, Feb 3, 2022
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2022
    It's a huge difference saying it is political (it is in a way) or stigmatizing an individual with your idea of its political direction. I don'T need that. Did I ever tried it at you?

    Your pseudointellectual fuss does not detract from the fact that your arguing is following that primitive mechanism.
    One creates a political image of a person, which then can be attacked. It's then further decorated with additional negative imaginations
    Finally there is a complex imagination of the person and "Sweden did it best" is sufficient to beat that idea feeling a sort of self-affirmation. (I knew it, how 'he' is)....it don't stop here, a fantasy joined the imagination and the dream of wiping the floor with it, something that came from that person, completes the illusion.

    Sweden did it best is my personal assessment. Get cool with it!
    I think the readers here are mature enough to make an own opinion about the Swedish way.

    Your actual level of intellect....
     
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  18. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Some are, for sure. Based on ALL AVAILABLE EVIDENCE, not based on your "strictly now and we forget what has happened before" so called evidence. Now, that would be quite a challenge, if they only had your carefully picked "data" (by your own admission), seen through the prism or "skewed" by the vision of your gurus. And they'd be confused, given how you keep changing your position - not according to the data but drastically, depending on a new guru or otherwise... As documented above...

    Now, that is "politicking" on your part (mine remains steady and coherent throughout!) and it's not that "primitive" as it is "poor"! Intellectually poor. This pretending you do not know who you are in bed with... Really, Yen... I understand that it is embarrassing to find out from somebody else where you actually are, in which bed exactly - but still...

    I just hope it does not come back to bite us ALL in the arse, this libertarian + hard right wing marriage of convenience (yet again!!!)...

    Sweden is the most shameful story in all this C-19 mess. I hoped they wouldn't stoop so low AGAIN, alas... they did! And somebody better say it! I am well aware of their foibles, having lived there, having studied them and Social Democracy in particular, up close and personal... So, these big issues (whether great achievements or nasty failures, like eugenics in Sweden) certainly wouldn't be missed by me, as they are by you, because it suits your narrow ideological narrative at this moment...
     
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  19. Yen

    Yen Admin (retired)
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    #3960 Yen, Feb 3, 2022
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2022
    I want to share what I have found about BA.2.
    The subject "When will there be new variants".

    It's called 'stealth' because it has not the SGTF (S gene target failure) at PCR tests, so it cannot be distinguished from former variants such as delta anymore using SGTF. Therefore a complete sequencing is needed.

    There is an application on github, "pangolin" and also a similar app called "Scorpio".
    Goal of these apps is to go through viral sequences, to assign it to a existing lineage and / or to prompt if there is a new variant. (As being said, variants are human definitions.)

    They could not determine how to categorize that new sequence. "failed to get assigned to any lineage...."
    The corresponding thread is found on GitHub
    https://github.com/cov-lineages/pango-designation/issues/359

    And then there was a "Proposal to split B.1.1.529 to incorporate a newly characterised sibling lineage"
    Here you also find the differences (mutations).
    https://github.com/cov-lineages/pango-designation/issues/361

    And here :
    https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1483768659420094464.html

    What to learn by that?

    To mutate is a natural force on SARS-CoV-2, but:
    A new variant will appear as soon as humans are determining a new one!
    By this we have a huge factor to control emotions on the pandemic!!!
    They split and renamed an previous lineage to incorporate what we call now BA.2 and BA.3.

    They could have determined a new variant (no incorporation into 'Omicron')...and viola the impression of the pandemic of people like gorski who have no background would be completely different.
    Before you @gorski get worried if there is a new right-wing influence on Sweden (or on me) better make clear that you are far more prone to political manipulations at the pandemic because you are lacking of scientific knowledge, which could make you resistant about.
     
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