Coronavirus | Discussion

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Deleted member 1254778, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    I recently heard about a successful attempt to cure long Covid by giving a person 2 doses of vaccine (I think it was Pfizer, not sure), if memory serves, as in giving the body something external to fight... Heard anything about it?
     
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  2. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #4222 Yen, Apr 10, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2022
    Yes, I heard about it.
    From where I know that: It was an own experience of a doc that reported that about his own patients. It was a YouTube video.
    AFAIK they got COVID and then long COVID and were unvaxxed. After the first shot they got better already. But also he had patients without that effect.

    On the contrary I know about a study that reports more adverse events of the vaccine when gotten natural infection (without any long term issues) before...
    I think severe covid and long covid are very individual conditions.

    The most interesting thing to know would be:
    Is it because of a deficiency (for instance minerals and vitamins) at that time one gets infected.
    Or is it the genetics of the own individual which is responsible for that. (that would mean it happens either way)
    Or at long covid: Is it a training effect. The first encountering went wrong. The second (by vaccination) resolves the 'issue' at some people.

    The discovery of current research:
    At severe covid the immune cells, some monocytes, behave 'abnormal'. They do not eliminate the virus which is covered with antibodies, they get infected due to ADE.

    Then they commit suicide. But not the 'silent one' apoptosis without releasing inflammatory mediators, the 'mad' one inflammatory death (pyroptosis) releasing an huge amount of..
    Also when they migrate to tissues such as lung tissue and become macrophages there they are affected.

    At long covid the immune system creates auto antibodies against G-protein coupled receptors. They are involved in a wide variety of physiological processes. That's the reason why long covid has a complex set of symptoms.
    Severe covid has 'just' one a cascade. But severe (inflammatory and very destructible process).

    Long Covid:
    A new encountering with the antigen (vaccine or virus) is like a new attempt for the immune system to deal with it. Not from the very beginning because it is primed already (not naive anymore), but somehow a re-enabling.
    At some cases it seems the second attempt is more successful and can resolve a stuck cycle. At some not.

    At severe covid they administer steroids for a short period of time. Some give additional supplements. Steroids suppress the immune system and by that inflammation as well. It's like a stop sign. The 'art' of that is. To stop a mad gone immune system temporarily to re-enable a new start.
    But if stopped a too log time the virus replicates more and more...
     
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  3. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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  4. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #4224 Yen, Apr 13, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
    Yes, old and wishy-washy...improvement, but no complete resolution at some, at some no effect at all, at some even worse.... could be even coincidental....or temporary...I mean if current idea is right (auto antibody) then there is no causal MOA why vaccination should help, except to 'distract' the immune system from making those AAbs...

    Besides of that things have changed.
    Many people are already vaccinated.

    We have now Omicron and BA.2, the vaccine is still old Wuhan spike.
    And Omicron causes far less long COVID per se...
    And long haul post vaccine syndrome has similarities to long COVID.


    I bet loss of taste and sense of smell also belongs to long COVID!
    At both senses there are also G-protein coupled receptors involved.

    Maybe I had one of them AABs, too. (Issue lasted 3 weeks)....

    It's more reasonable that's the virus or a part of it (spike) causes long haul at some individuals.
    That would explain long haul post vaccine syndrome, too.
     
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  5. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #4225 Yen, Apr 14, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2022
    Let me place here a key study, which explains a novel mechanism of the mRNA vaccine. (As being said I use this thread as my own reference when I need the links again to share).

    It describes the involvement of exosomes. It was originally unexpected and still not included when 'pros' are explaining how mRNA vaccines against COVID are working.
    It explains why there is TH1 pathway activation.
    It also shows that the Spike protein circulates through the blood 'using' exosomes. And that up to 4 months.

    The vaccine makers strictly denied that 'the vaccine' would leave the injection site (deltoid muscle).....now it's 'common sense' that is does!

    Cutting Edge: Circulating Exosomes with COVID Spike Protein Are Induced by BNT162b2 (Pfizer–BioNTech) Vaccination prior to Development of Antibodies: A Novel Mechanism for Immune Activation by mRNA Vaccines | The Journal of Immunology (jimmunol.org)

    The vaccines have been mass administered even though the detailed MOA was not known that time.....
    But what's more and more clear is:

    The produced antigen and the LNP's do last a longer time in human body than expected.
    They spread more in human body as expected. (antigen and particles enter the blood stream)
    The antigen they produce is more pathogenic than expected. (The S protein per se is more toxic than expected. To choose the S protein as an antigen was not the best idea)
    The immune defence obtained by vaccination is weaker than hoped for. (no IgA)
    The waning of protection is faster than expected.
     
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  6. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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  7. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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    There is a huge push for boosters so they can sell off their old stock. It's craziness, people need to be cognizant of this

    https://www.deseret.com/coronavirus...-vaccine-booster-too-many-shots-immune-system
     
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  8. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    It seems recently they define more variants.
    I already put a link about the XD, XE and XF recombinant variants.
    It's good to know they categorized those from New York as sub variants of BA.2 and reported them as being more contagious.

    So it seems 'the optimum' is the main Omicron lineage which is approximating...no complete new variant, this means it should be equally or even less virulent.

    Israel data about the 4th shoot is already showing protection even less period of time. Sort of immune exhaustion.
    https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/coronavirus-discussion.81224/page-211#post-1730374
    IMHO the 4th shot makes no sense anymore.

    Using a new vaccine makes also only little sense.
    Until they can release the Omicron related vaccine it's gone, too.
    And by that you'd put additional escape pressure on the Omicron / BA.2 lineage. It seems the Omicron / BA.2 lineage is naturally 'stabilizing' by developing sub lineages of it.
     
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  9. Bat.1

    Bat.1 MDL Expert

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    Bat present wife has been a Hep-B carrier since early childhood. Her sister died of it when they were like 7-8 years old, but wifey's Hep-B was never active. Fast forward to her 2022 check up and we're waiting on results from more blood tests after the first test showed it active. Only difference this year is she's been twice vaxxed and once boosted o_O
     
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  10. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    No, that probably has nothing to do with it.

    I have been in the same situation and it was accidentally found many years ago, even though the virus (Hep-B) was inactive but present in some dark corner of my liver...

    I went for a routine health check-up and they made more thorough tests and - barely found it... Long ago, when I was a kid I was infected, my body defeated the virus but then didn't kick it out completely, given it was totally defeated... the doc said... Chances of me passing it on were infinitesimal!

    All my partners were contacted, none of them got it, woman after woman went to check themselves and none of them were positive!

    Still, it's clever to get vaccinated against 2 out of 3 versions of Hep that we have, since one can get it from just about anything, easily... One has 1 month to get vaccinated after the initial contact with an infected person and one's body will always be one step ahead of the virus!
     
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  11. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Yes, most likely it has to do with them. There's plenty of scientific and clinical evidence new gene therapies wrong called vaccines are causing reactivation of old viral infections and cancers and long long etcetera.
     
  12. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Too many long words for ya, give it up...
     
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  13. ipx

    ipx MDL Addicted

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    #4233 ipx, Apr 17, 2022
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2022
    .
     
  14. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    I agree with the first part (I am vaxxed against Hep. A and B), but there are more than 3 types of Hepatitis. There is Hepatitis A to E.
    Some time there even had been reports about F and G.
    F was a misreporting and G turned out to be a Flavivirus called GB-Virus C (GBV C).

    Reactivation of dormant viruses.
    It's no topic for a personal fight. Every day people publish works about SARS-COV-2. So if it can reactivate hepatitis there should be works / studies about. And also if it applies to vaccination.

    Most reactivations are shingles and since it's a Herpes virus also Herpes simplex (cold sores). But also EBV (I had EBV so I of course was very interested about).
    A workmate had got shingles after 2nd shot.
     
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  15. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25651806/
     
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  16. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #4236 Yen, Apr 19, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2022
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  17. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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  18. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #4239 Yen, Apr 21, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2022
    This video is great.
    I love the way of having a wider perspective on a phenomenon (ups and downs / waves of infections and the driving forces).
    There is correlation on latitude and by that sunlight. That also was very plausible to me a long time ago..... I thought about vit D as being a representative factor, but did not know intracellular melatonin production is related to NIR.

    I knew about ROS and mitochondria (also energy supply)...

    Since radiation of sunlight (it has an own spectrum) is responsible for complex effects,... to pick out one substance alone might not be able to explain the correlation.

    The melatonin and indoor / outdoor hypothesis should be verified in a study. Sounds plausible, but does not explain why there are on one hand vit D level studies with clear association to severe COVID, whereas on the other hand there are studies (administering vit D) with no significant effect. (Indoor / outdoor) isn't a study factor which could be taken to differentiate.

    I still think the benefit of vit. D supplement is the greater the lower your original levels had been.

    On recent successful treatment protocols and also prophylaxis protocols you find vitamin D and melatonin together.

    The suggestion to make studies with sunlight itself is nice, but what would you do in wintertime?

    You'd have to 'reproduce' the sun effect, either by artificial sunlight (therapy) or initiating the same biochemistry for instance taking melatonin and vit.D

    Melatonin is not just a 'sleeping agent'...its biochemistry is complex.
    It's an antioxidant and has effects on mitochondria.
     
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  19. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Hmm... Nothing at all?
    Why would we have to wrongly alter the "design" thinking it's for our own good?
    There must be a reason things differ in wintertime respect summertime. Perhaps another body chemistry processes have to be favored to keep our body's health. Who knows, more science is needed though.