Coronavirus | Discussion

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Deleted member 1254778, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. shtrumf

    shtrumf MDL Junior Member

    Sep 20, 2009
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    Quick tests are not trustworthy.The only test that is accurate is the cotton swab thingy with samples collected form nose and throat.I really don't get it why they are promoting this quick tests.
     
  2. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #462 Yen, Apr 29, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2020
    Please be careful making general statements!

    There are reliable COVID-19 antibody (ELISA) tests already.
    And they are not more than 40$. (A reliable German one here is 20 €).

    The problem is there are a lot of fake tests (internet or streets)
    The tests are specific there is no way to get a false positive by H1N1.

    They are also specific to SARS-CoV-2 IgG and IgM.....there are also confirmation tests which confirm 3 proteins (N, S1 and S2) additionally.

    The reason why they are not 100% is that every human is different....there can be an unpredictable individual interference and there can be user mistakes when applying...

    A proper test has a control stripe C (to see that you have made no mistake) and an separate IgG and IgM stripe.
    Cleartest (Germany) offers a good one also Biomerica inc. (California).

    Also you should know its purpose. It is NOT made to check if you are infected or not.

    It is made to check if you have got antibodies and hence are CURED and if the antibodies are still in an 'earlier' state where you still could be infectious. Still IgM positive, too.
     
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  3. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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    Hopefully we here in the U.S. can start using those ELISA test too. But so far, we are not that far into making reliable tests, I am sure they are working on getting better results though...
    https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/04/4...-assays-scrutinized-accuracy-ucsf-uc-berkeley
     
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  4. MS_User

    MS_User MDL Guru

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    I hear the second wave of this virus is going to hit us like a ton of bricks wait next month when people start coming out in herds....what i find must disturbing is how people are out their with out any mask on:eek:
     
  5. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #465 Yen, Apr 29, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2020
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  6. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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    #466 Joe C, Apr 29, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2020
    I agree, in the U.S. idiots are having a temper tantrum because they can not have their spoiled way, The govt is going to cave in and let things start up too soon. "Ya can't fix stupid"
     
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  7. zen45

    zen45 MDL Addicted

    Feb 25, 2010
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    the governors are making their own choice as what to do there not paying attention to any body ! California and Florida have opened beaches and you cant swim with a face mask on! oh and on the issue of face masks and medicine guess who supply's most of the worlds supply "china" why greed cheap labor and price and they don't care if the quality is poor, its cheap ! and who knows for sure if there will be a second wave of the virus ? will it come back every fall like the flu ? we speculate, we wont have enough information until next year at this time when we have gone thru a full cycle of this viruses life
     
  8. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

    Jul 26, 2012
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  9. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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  10. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    I have d/l the pdf and read it later....

    The Vitamin D metabolism and vit. D processes are very complex but one needs to know a bit of it....and to know that there is actually no consensus about the 'right' vitamin D level.

    The direct vitamin D uptake from food plays a minor role only.

    Human body can create vitamin D on its own by synthesis from cholesterol (sun light and heat / skin)
    Cholesterol in liver--->7-dehydrocholesterol
    7-dehydrocholesterol + UV-B rays (skin)---->Previtamin D
    Previtamin D + heat----> Vitamin D3 = Cholecalciferol

    Usually measured is an inactive form of vitamin D it's 25-OH-D3 Calcidiol. It is circulating through body bond at vitamin D binding protein (DPB). It is also the form of storage in liver.

    The supply with vitamin D is evaluated by this form (circulating form and form of storage) and NOT by the active form of vitamin D which is Calcitriol 1,25-(OH)2-D3

    The body can create active vitamin D on demand from the storage / circulating form.
    Active vitamin D Calcitriol acts like a hormone and has influence on various (VDR= Vitamin D receptors) cell processes.


     
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  11. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    #471 Mr.X, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
    So just let your body expose to sunlight between 11 - 15 hrs. ten or fifteen minutes a day. You'll be helping to boost your immune system and overall health.
     
  12. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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    @Mr.X: Or just drink milk, although some people can't stand milk or are lactose intolerant.

    Personally, I like the beach. IMHO salt water is more healthy for you than pool water.
    That should get you a lot of sunlight. :)

    I was taking vitamin D3, and I'm wondering if it has any effect.
     
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  13. WindowsGeek

    WindowsGeek MDL Expert

    Jun 30, 2015
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    i love the beach also but i don't think the beaches are safes place to be now.
     
  14. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #474 Yen, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
    @Michaela Joy

    I have read the pdf.
    TBH I cannot recognize any use of the study.

    This is the first line at -conclusions-
    And compared to the headline:

    I even cannot agree with their suggestions. The study is n=20.

    Generally correlation is not causality. A causality and vitamin D is only at rachitis AFAIK.

    Older people do generally produce lesser amount of vit. D by own in-body synthesis. And severity correlates maybe more to age. On the other hand supplemental vit. D could help here compensating a lesser synthesis rate...

    Vitamin D levels and in-body regulation is a complex and conditioned mechanism...it also depends where you have grown up as a child (sun level)...and got used to....

    Vitamin D can act as immune modulator that is no question. But to associate an deficiency with COVID-19 severity ermm well is very dared....

    The study is not peer reviewed yet (I would let it fail, but I am no medic and do not know what's their scientific claim).

    Generally I am no big fan of taking supplemental vitamins. (Except there is an illness which is clearly associated to a vitamin deficiency.)
    Balanced nutrition and yes sun, a bit of sports and fresh air instead of vit. supp.

    My 2 cents. :)
     
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  15. MrG

    MrG MDL Expert

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    #475 MrG, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: May 1, 2020
    Last night the city of Torrance, CA played over & over a WHO graphic show w/ their Testing recommendations, spread, Treatment, fatality by age & comorbid conditions.
    I took around 40 photos to remember what they were saying.
    Attached is the one on (drug) Treatment.

    *Edit: no one liked my graphic so I removed it.
     
  16. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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  17. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    There is ample evidence of not only immunity being impaired due to lack of vitamins, Yen...

    And the right levels of vitamins (C in particular) are unknown and debated! Since the discovery of vitamin C, the Hungarian lad who did it, in his discussions with Linux Pauling, if memory serves, expressed very clear doubts if the minimal levels which are prescribed against dying of scurvy are actually the same for the best possible health... He disagreed with such "minimalism", against the BS "advice" some medical and scientific advice we hear today...

    A young cow produces 10g of it in its glands above kidneys. Huge doses are scientifically established for gorillas, too.

    Just not Humans, one of ONLY(!!!) 2 species on Earth which have lost the ability to produce it - they speculate it was because of the abundance of it in our (always fresh food type of) diet, as we were evolving from primates, some genetic mutation prevailed, as beneficial/more efficient(???)... It didn't turn out to be "advantageous" when we were searching for new continents/sources to plunder, on slow ships, eating crap food, as the shipmates were dying of scurvy etc. Also later, when junk food was invented... Linus Pauling mentions a California woman who was operated upon countless times before they discovered she never ate fruit, just McDonald's s**te etc. - and she was literally falling apart before doctors' eyes - they did not understand it and kept "patching her up" surgically, instead of giving her vitamins and minerals... She recovered fully, after she "discovered" she was supposed to eat oranges from her garden...

    So, what happened? Well, in the meantime - since we lost the ability to produce vitamin C in our bodies - we invented intensive farming, a very long road from a farm/abattoir to a table, i.e. storing and/or processing food for longer periods of time, refrigeration and freezing, not just (over)cooking that was not conducive to maintaining good levels of micronutrients - especially some vitamins are destroyed wholesale in the (capitalist) processing of food and so on and so forth...

    There are other factors in all this, of course. Sedentary culture, for instance, couch-potatoes, that is, not really moving, shoving tons of calories into our static selves, especially sugars (and way too much fats, especially some types of fat). The deadly combination of fat and table sugar (chocolate, for instance), comprising of half glucose (which we are used to, up to 300g a day, on average) and fructose, which we are not used to so much and hence... coronary etc. diseases....

    There are studies showing clearly that leaner mice and rats are not only much more energetic but also their immune system is way more efficient and better functioning, that they are sexually more capable and so on...

    So, if one thinks historically, I would surmise, one should be aware of where and when one lives and therefore act wisely, i.e. accordingly, in all directions: vitamins, minerals (not only the allegedly "fresh food" but supplements, as well), exercise ("gymnastics" was invented by rich, slave owners of Ancient Greece who were liberated from labour => "to exercise naked"), change of diet and so on and so forth, being a prudent course of action...

    As for antibiotics (Azitromycin is Pliva's [Zagreb, back then Yugoslavia, now Croatia] product, originally called Sumamed, the most potent one we have today): they do not have known effect on viruses but only secondary infections, which come after the original viral infection. Hence, when one's general immunity is down, some otherwise subdued but potentially nasty bacteria - which can be found in us at the best of times - can proliferate badly and then Sumamed can play a vital role but... cum grano salis...

    Anti-virals would be a much more interesting proposition but the ones we made a while back might not be so helpful nowadays, with new viruses...
     
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  18. Joe C

    Joe C MDL Guru

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    Facebook should not be used as a reliable source of information
     
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  19. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

    Oct 21, 2009
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    And arrogant, utterly uniformed and obviously aggressive people should not be advertising all that... ahem... uninformedness, as it were... See, if you are so vocal about your "uninformedness" - it comes awfully close to... not being very... ahem... intelligent, shall we say....

    Source: How to Live Longer and Feel Better by Linus Pauling, the only man to have 2 Nobel prizes alone, as in not sharing it with anyone...... The first being for changing the nature of Chemistry, i.e. his 3 dimensional insights into it, so go figure... Joe or Linus... Well, it's a tough choice but hey...
     
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  20. PointZero

    PointZero MDL Member

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    #480 PointZero, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
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