@gorski We often talked at cross purposes. And that is my fault. I did not exactly relate to what I actually mean. I meant a particular measure / restriction here in Germany or Europe and you came up where it worked well or were they did it well. By doing that I had empathy -yes- with those suffering from the restrictions. The bad thing is -and that is by nature of things- that if you lower restrictions you 'accept' that some more people get infected. But that does not mean I have no empathy at all or lost it...far the opposite. In the meantime even Mr. Spahn has admitted that some measures were useless and we can learn by that. We have to live with corona many more months or even years and we have to find a way where the groups of people who are still restricted at exercising their jobs can get back to normal life. (Artists, musicians, club owners, cinema, theaters..and all the others who are still partly restricted). There is still the 'opinion' 'we' don't need that, so we can wait. But it's based on unreasonable thinking. I mean why one can go to a huge supermarket but still not to theater / concerts?!? Why were there no open air events even though we know now more about how super spreading did happen? How does declaring a region to a high risk area or an event to a high risk event work and what does it really change? The challenge to live with corona is by far more important than to lockdown 'until' we could know what corona really is. A lockdown or even lock up of people is an artificial inhuman situation that kills human society. It can be tolerated only a short period of time and has to be reasoned very properly and with caution. (Macron: We are at war!) I mean WTF?!? What a dork. Also wearing a mask does restrict a lot. Have you ever carried one at 35 degrees all the day? Have you seen the people how they carry it? With their nose uncovered? Or how frequently do they exchange them really? Many people don't like it and they do only carry it because you get punished by fines if caught without. They carry one and the same many days... But the worst is that people who do not wear one get wildly discredited by other people or even blamed being a potential murderer. This does not only apply to wearing masks. It also applies to other individual 'measures' (ideas of how to protect). Some of those people who are more restrictive do blame others who are more 'easy'...driven by fear and lack of information they quickly have spotted 'a guilty one'! This is very very sad...
Traveling during Covid-19 a 10 minute read: Travel in the time of COVID-19 has been difficult, to say the very least. Flights have been grounded, entire countries have closed, local tourist economies have suffered and vacation selfies have been absent from social media feeds. (No complaints about that last one.) >huge snip< What about once you’re in the water? It doesn’t feel like it’s unsafe? No, it doesn’t. I try and stay away from the news. The news is gnarly. The more scared they make people, the more money they make. That freaks me out, watching that stuff. Like, the last time we were in Texas, some of my friends from home we’re like: ‘you’re in Texas right now? Are you watching the news? Like, there’s like the craziest outbreak ever. The hospitals are overflowing. And if you get COVID, you can’t even get into a hospital.’ The next day, my friend almost lost his eye in the wavepool. His board hit him. We had to rush to the hospital and there was nobody there. There was no wait in urgent care. There were two different doctors, like spending time with him. They had nothing else to do. It was super mellow in there. I don’t know what that means, but, when I turn on the news it’s totally different from what’s really happening. I’m not a conspiracy theory guy, but I take what’s on the news with a grain of salt these days way more than I used to. Whole story w/ photos: https://www.surfline.com/surf-news/...il&utm_source=customer.io&utm_type=newsletter
If it ain't happening to you it does not mean it is not happening to whole lot of other people... And yes, even if it isn't you, if you're not susceptible, if you're asymptomatic - it's about "the other". Hence "society", "being of community" - not being self-centred, selfish, strictly "me, me, me" (as Hegel puts it, is the root of all evil in the world). So, one should remember that when one is judging here - lives are at stake! P.S. I fully agree that who makes the decisions and how, by which procedures etc, is essential in all this. Some of these measures/decisions have not been thought through properly, for instance some older people, people with dementia etc. have been wronged and are suffering, since their families can't give them a hug and a kiss, remind them of their past and present, sure. All legitimate questions. But that is a different set of questions and we should debate those as well, just not mix it all in a mish-mash where nothing is actually discussed properly, to the end, from the same principles. Like that "professor" whom I find to be utterly confused and unable to think straight, logically and carefully, for love or money...
Bat be fa·ce·tious Key facts Approximately 1.35 million people die each year as a result of road traffic crashes. The2030 Agenda for Sustainable Development has set an ambitious target of halving the global number of deaths and injuries from road traffic crashes by 2020. Road traffic crashes cost most countries 3% of their gross domestic product. More than half of all road traffic deaths are among vulnerable road users: pedestrians, cyclists, and motorcyclists. 93% of the world's fatalities on the roads occur in low- and middle-income countries, even though these countries have approximately 60% of the world's vehicles. Road traffic injuries are the leading cause of death for children and young adults aged 5-29 years. Every year the lives of approximately 1.35 million people are cut short as a result of a road traffic crash. Between 20 and 50 million more people suffer non-fatal injuries, with many incurring a disability as a result of their injury. Road traffic injuries cause considerable economic losses to individuals, their families, and to nations as a whole. These losses arise from the cost of treatment as well as lost productivity for those killed or disabled by their injuries, and for family members who need to take time off work or school to care for the injured. Road traffic crashes cost most countries 3% of their gross domestic product. So using "Liberal Logic" (sic) Anyone who drives a car or takes a bus is a MURDERER !!! It's Pass Time to Stop de BS PanicDemic If You're afraid to get out of your house then STAY THERE. Let those of us who aren't afraid live our lifes Ooops Fergots to Credit: https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/road-traffic-injuries
Ars Technica: Evidence slowly building for long-term heart problems post-COVID-19. https://arstechnica.com/science/202...g-for-long-term-heart-problems-post-covid-19/
@R29k About a third of Floridian kids are infected but most are asymptomatic. No one can tell at this point what the long term possible consequences are, how this might affect their respiratory tract or anything else for that matter - so this is rather worrying.... But most people are like that: if it doesn't affect them and if it isn't happening right now and badly - it isn't happening...
Bat older brother got hit with myocarditis and/or pericardites as a teen. (In 1960 LoUiSiAna de only place "diagnosing and treating" that was The Childrens Ward @ Big Charity in New Orleans) so de diagnosis isn't clear. He attended his Junior and Senior Years of High School in bed at home. Teachers and Students would move an intercom between classrooms. There was an old barn full of Bats in a field by our house brother likes to hunt...so maybe him was first case of Kung Flu from eating a bat Me gone message him and find out
https://thehill.com/changing-americ...r-EEUsFUJwVMtusWwHD4Sbo_W5NpbiZZ2FdNnzZB1YZKg Alonso described X-rays that reveal damage caused to human lungs by the coronavirus, even for people without severe symptoms. "They are seeing there is damage to the lungs in these asymptomatic children. ... We don't know how that is going to manifest a year from now or two years from now," Alonso told reporters. "Is that child going to have chronic pulmonary problems or not?"
Capitalism at work: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...ed-maine-wedding-n1239353?cid=sm_npd_nn_fb_ma Very "clever"....
Of course it is happening. Deaths by anaphylactic shocks at Aspirin administration did happen. (Just saying individual 'extraordinary' reactions happen all the time). I assume nobody of us here who is posting has been infected by SARS-CoV-2 (yet). Means, we are not affected by it and / or asymptomatology, but we do not deny that it is happening. Why should we? The question here -at first place- is what does it mean to ME (the consumer of such news) getting such a info! Speaking of "society" "being of community" it will be always individual speakers, the individual, 'me', those (individuals) who are thinking about the 'society' by categorisation what 'it' means to the 'society'. It's all about how such news are presented, in which context, what's the source and finally how the reader is categorizing such infos. (Personal risk evaluation / risk categorisation...or simply 'worries')... If the media's / politicians purpose is to spread fear by informing out of context, then such media / politicians are harmful as well. (Spreading fear / big headlines is best-selling for most media)... Nobody of us exactly knows what will happen if getting infected by corona. But some of us know other diseases such as FLU. To make a proper categorisation only a progress comparison to other known diseases and categorisation by that makes sense. By comparing to something that is personally known or even self-experienced one can make a real categorisation. Anything else remains a vague imagination. And we know that a flu can come along with the same asymptomatic progresses as well...
I see all mainstream media and not so mainstream, are spreading fear. Government s officials at least in Mexico love to spread the disease... of fear.
Words of a scientist who really knows his stuff. Not a ridiculous guy who thinks everything is fixed with discussions or arguments without real evidence.
@Mr.X ....... i'm at 7.57 now ...... when does he actualy start to say something ? ...... the message ? ...... the point ? He likes the sound of his own voice ........... sounds like a mentaly confused old mary popins reading a story to backward kids ....... but all hes realy doing is moaning ............ spreading confusion ...... and saying tha corona is no worse than flu and the whole thing is a conspiracy ? Whens he going to say what he ' thinks ' should happen ? His silver bullet ? JFC Hes nuts . The only thing missing is reptilians .
health experts predict here in the US about 3000 deaths per day by the end of september december mainly due to peoples negligence and carelessness and a vaccine will take even longer not many people are volunteering for trial runs...maybe next year things will improve will have to wait and see
@Yen, sorry but I really have to question/challenge your assertions: you already changed your (reasoned and reasonable) position once for one which is clearly driven by a certain belief in somebody else ("a leader"), as much as your suddenly and rather mysteriously radically changed understanding of statistics... What makes you a "measure" by anyone's standards now, what should make anyone not seriously question your judgement now that you have already changed your position drastically, having watched a guy who really sounds like he can't think for love or money....? (He may well be a great scientist in his narrow field but he sure as hell is NOT a guy to listen to when it comes to public health policy advice, as he is clearly not trained in any of that and he clearly does not understand "Do no harm!", never mind his rather confused "reasoning", which a first year philosophy student can destroy with a few Formal Logic lessons under his/her belt...)
Wow, this is quite revealing. Now I got you poor soul. Now it's clear to my somewhat limited intelligence your arrogant behavior and thought patterns. Sure you don't feel God / Superior Power fulfilling your miserable existence. Wow everyday we can learn interesting stuff, pretty much. Promise: this is the last time I quote you or even reply to you. Not worth any effort. Lol
Anybody trained in logics can unpick him in 5 minutes flat. You are not trained in that. Whatever you are trained in, I am sure you can do well... Obviously, this ain't "it", sadly... On the other hand, this only reveals your complexes... Hence your pattern of behaviour, constantly falling for the lowest common denominator... I associate it with the Right. It seems you have some growing up to do... I'm OK with that, I'll give you time, as in "I have the good will to not take this badly"... But do you?