Coronavirus | Discussion

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Deleted member 1254778, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

    Oct 21, 2009
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    #1781 gorski, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
    Capitalism and in particular adversarial, neo-liberal model of it has failed!!!

    This is how Humans are at their best - co-operating, pouring resources into constructive purposes!!! The things we could do if....

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/25/scientists-covid-studies-vaccine-2020

    And in the UK almost no one even knows of prof. Djikic and Goethe Institute (Frankfurt), the Team that figured out how the virus propagates and immediately published its findings in the Open Source spirit of co-operation and spreading, sharing the knowledge, as the Spirit that unites, not divides, as neo-liberal dogma would have us at each other's throats all the time!

    I bet the open community spirit of publicly funded scientists have made it possible but.... maybe one day somebody would actually demonstrate how this works...

    I know they invited prof. Djikic to the US, he went there, shared his Team's findings, they even wanted to poach him but he remained firm and stayed on as the head of the Team... Hat down!!!
     
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  2. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #1782 Yen, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
    @parafer
    You might want to google about 'The Swedish Way', to get an own impression.
    It basically covers lots of things I also posted when being asked what I think what's right.

    It's not static, they learned from former mistakes (actually every nation had made mistakes).

    Their strategy is not primarily made to focus on mass vaccination. (I assume they have enough from Pandemrix when they had swine flu).
    It's based on commands and insight and own responsibility instead of punishment. Also no general lockdowns.
    But it is FAR away from getting naturally and freely 'herd immunity'.
    They're actively intervening and protecting-


    Ivermectin has already lost single patent protection. It's common law that drugs are losing it after a period of time in order to have cheap generics made by competitors.

    The GB strain is scientifically (sequence) determined and has nothing to do with vaccination.

    I also had a look at the GB mutation. It's reasonable that the vaccines are still working.
    There might be a few antibodies which do not work anymore (if they bind to the epitopes that consist of mutated parts), but there are still lots who are doing.
    What definitely will stop working are monoclonal antibodies who have the special target that has mutated at the S-protein.

    The huge amount of adverse effects and if they are in a healthy relation to benefit is another topic.
    Also since you provoke an immune answer by vaccination you'll get 'symptoms' more or less...

    I rather think it's the nano lipids that cause the allergic reactions.
     
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  3. MaveRick23

    MaveRick23 MDL Member

    Apr 13, 2013
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    hello community. what about that vaccine? is it danger for health or life?
     
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  4. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    #1784 parafer, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
    I maintain that the Swedish way is more about the sensibility of the individual than it is the top-down approach (or lack of it). You apply the same measures in other cultures and geographies and you would have starkly different outcomes, as evidenced in many places (unless you posit that lockdowns or government measures CAUSE widespread infections). So where the individual approach is compromised (people in care facilities like the elderly who can't take care of themselves) you saw the higher death rate in those areas when compared to the other Nordic countries. Like I mentioned in one of my previous posts, Sweden should have had spot-approaches for these situations, but overrode those concerns too long in favor of this almost cult-like obeisance to the "father of the nation" Tegnell. I'm not saying they didn't learn from mistakes or that the government approach was a total failure. I think it went the way it went in Sweden due to the personal responsibility individuals took among other factors. And people in various countries did the same. So of course there is limited efficacy of government mandates and policies, but then again that also doesn't mean there shouldn't be a government policy beyond reminding people to be responsible. So again I say the results in certain countries are to great degree culturally, geographically, population density, lifestyle, etc., defined. And perhaps a stronger government response in a similar country (like another Nordic country) was less effective than the same response in a country culturally and geographically dissimilar. So I do not see the Swedish way as one universally applicable. And I can't see anyone making that claim based on consideration of all the aforementioned. Take for instance the incessant eating out at restaurants which is such an integral part of American society. It is so in cities as well as in the smallest towns in the countryside. And it did not stop during COVID. Fast food galore. You can't underestimate the difference cultural factors like this can make in spread.

    Just imagine Sweden having the tourism influx of a country such as Italy, of which 1/4th of the economy is tourism. Likewise, New York with its travel influx and its gigantic infection rates and death tolls (1000 people a day at one point). Imagine these had adopted "The Swedish Way". The spread is due to specific conditions like these, not assuaged by any approach of the Swedish government. They were able to adopt their measures due to the general condition of that country. So again it cannot be a general recommendation of other conditions/countries. Imagine travel wouldn't have been suspended in NYC or Italy at those crucial points. There is just no justification for generalization here.
     
  5. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #1785 gorski, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    No, Yen, you are absolutely wrong about the Swedish way! I already explained this to you, earlier in the thread (not that you responded, since you simply ignore that which does not fit your guru's prejudices and dogma) - not once - but you are just Teutonicaly pig-headed about it!

    Even the chief architect of the "Swedish way" stated that they would do it differently now, having learnt a few things about it in the meantime, i.e. admitting gross errors in judgement, akin to 'your' "thinking". Despite all that, they continued unabated, more-or-less, with huge amounts of dead people in the wake (at least 4 - 5 times greater number than their 3 Scandiland neighbours COMBINED!!!).

    I know why that is, I lived there for 3 1/2 years. They are even worse when it comes to superiority complex than the proverbial Teutons... "The jewel in the crown of the Teutons". The rose of the Teutons. They are now paying a huge price!

    A while back somebody came up with this:

    Swedish model for C-19 on word level.jpg

    "If all the countries of the world were as 'successful' as Sweden, the world would have had 4,5 million people dead, instead of 1 million".

    But it doesn't make you think...

    Case-Sensitive actively routes for it (the "culling of Humanity").

    You are on the same page - but Buddhistically so... Suffering is "good"...

    I beg to differ!
     
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  6. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    #1786 Mr.X, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
    Do you think the appearance of SARS-COV-2 is mere coincidence?

    And the way psycholeaders responded with a clockwork agenda?

    Rhetorical questions, of course.
     
  7. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    #1787 parafer, Dec 26, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    Coincidence meaning two incidents occurring in tandem/together. So yes, it's coincidence if that. They didn't all occur together in time and in the same way though.
    Not all leaders responded in clockwork agenda at all (nor do I think it's even a fair thing to say in the first place) because some like Trump felt that the stock market was more important so they suppressed the seriousness of the virus for months.

    Your questions are already saturated with the indictment. And therefore you're right to say they are rhetorical, but I doubt you understood what you just admitted to. Namely that you're not truly asking these questions. Which is probably why you will never find certainty regarding the answers, because you're not looking for truth, you're looking for what fits your narrative.
     
  8. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    I wonder:

    Is the appearance of SARS-COV-2 a mere coincidence?

    And the way psycholeaders responded with a clockwork agenda to lock their people up, a mere coincidence too?

    I don't think so.
     
  9. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    What you do is you keep bringing up different scenarios to feed your broad suspicion of (by this point) everything. But you don't change your approach in any significant way to include more rigor and more intellectual accountability. So if you set the mental machine up this way, whatever you throw into it,the result that keeps coming out will have the same shape and characteristic. To me you don't seem to let the data change you. You keep looking for the data that fits your views. I think we all do that to an extent. But at least to me your approach seems to have a low likelihood of producing different results *even* when significantly different data gets introduced to it. Why the blanket, all-out suspicion of the entire world's governments? There is no reason to go there at all. That interpretation is just way beyond reasonable and also not congruent with one's previous world view I would think. You can better be the judge of that, but I am saying it comes across to me that way. I know we're just riffing, but it does make me wonder if this entertainment for you or something like that. Does it make you feel special to have this kind of off-beat view of everything? You know, some people try to establish themselves by trying to exist outside the mainstream as a way to affirm their identity. I notice it's mostly males doing this. Women don't usually seem to go that conspiratorial and maintain their common sense and emotional and societal accountability intact more (generally speaking).
     
  10. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    https://www.weforum.org/great-reset/


    I know for sure corona plandemic is not a natural coincidence.
     
  11. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Dumb-o.png

    So, a guy says "Last night we saw Contagion (2011). Well, you morons, the whole C-19 scenario is right there in the tiniest of details, you idiots, keep believing it occurred "naturally", yeah, right, dumb-asses..."

    And the other guy answers: "M8, you should check out "Dumbo"! Elephants flying and all - it's way out there, for real...."
     
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  12. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Just in case... :rolleyes: :p

    "It's dry up here - it's a lie we're sinking!

    "I won't get hypothermia if I drink chlorine dioxide!"

    "Nobody can make me put on a lifesaving jacket!!

    "Only the elderly and non-swimmers will die!"

    "My neighbour had diabetes, she did not die of drowning!"

    "1500 dead? Meh, more people die each year of strokes!"

    "This was financed by the lifeboat industry!"

    Kad je onomad Titanik tonuo - ista prica ko Covid.jpg
     
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  13. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #1793 gorski, Dec 27, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    Russian roulette is harmless!

    Ruski rulet je bezopasan.jpg

    As 5 out of 6 participants can vouch!

    It was used in Florida, thanx to its gov'ner...

    C19 Russian Roullette.jpg
     
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  14. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Dictatorship, mmhhyeaaahhh...

    Corruption, mmmmyaaahhh...

    Unemployment, baaaahhhhh....

    Balkanska posla.jpg

    WHAT, MASKS?!?!?!?!? AARARRGHGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
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  15. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    My favourite....

    Simplistic Dogma v. complex Truth.jpg
     
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  16. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Alternatives?

    Let's see...

    Comparison - people v profit.jpg

    C19 comparison.jpg
     
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  17. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Who pays, who suffers the most (other than teachers, while we keep the schools open)?!?

    Nurses and doctors on the battle line.jpg

    NHS.jpg
     
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  18. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

    Dec 20, 2016
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    #1798 parafer, Dec 27, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    Mr. X should really get banned from MDL. Not because of his views -- he has a right to his views and so does everyone else.

    But it is another matter when he starts abusing other members through PM, where he says what he won't allow himself to say publicly, but is a confirmation of his low character and intelligence.

    This is what he sent me in PM:

    [​IMG]

    This is what it means, translated:

    [​IMG]

    So now you know what kind of characters we're dealing with here.
     
  19. vladnil

    vladnil MDL Senior Member

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    #1799 vladnil, Dec 27, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    Well written text is tolerant :D:D:D
    He didn't come to your house with a gun and didn't stand near the door?:eek:
    Then everything is fine ……… .this is life

    (Another question?
    How did you get the person so bad, what is the attitude?
    Maybe you are an NSA agent provocateur)
    You are lucky to be writing this!
    People come to us and speak aloud right in the face - you can hear enough of this in a day!
    People are different - this does not mean that they are bad.
     
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  20. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #1800 gorski, Dec 27, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
    Vlad, this is as ridiculous as you can get...

    This is worthy of a sanction, if a temporary one, provided there is an apology. No one should abuse anyone like that, full stop.

    But I hope it's a temporary aberration, rather than a full fallback to this kind of behaviour I hoped he left behind, as he professed and promised not to continue with...
     
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