Coronavirus | Discussion

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Deleted member 1254778, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    #1861 Mr.X, Jan 13, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
    Glad to read this. Haven't used it personally but I do believe is another cure for many infectious illnesses as chlorine dioxide. Cool.

    Hence we don't need killer pseudo-vaccines that really are obscure transgenic experiments.

    Not pricey at all considering it as a lifesaver
    https://www.farmaciasguadalajara.co...mebicidas-y-tricomonicidas/ivermectina-922560
     
  2. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    I agree, Yen. Let's not get personal when spreading misinformation. LOL
     
  3. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    If you believe you are smarter than me or believe what I post is misinformation, swallow your tongue and comments alone in the intimacy of your home but don't dare to quote me and try to "analyze" my every word by putting me in ridicule. Stick to this and we all are in peace. OKAY? Okay
     
  4. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    I have a family member who takes ivermectin and is now a zombie with yellow skin. But yeah this is totally legit and not misinformation at all to use a dog wormer!
     
  5. Tiger-1

    Tiger-1 MDL Guru

    Oct 18, 2014
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    is things are getting worse instead of getting better, here in my country 204,000 people died yesterday until vamov arrives ...;)
     
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  6. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    It is possible that in most people a drug might be effective but in a small percentage it creates problems or even serious problems...

    What one must not do is jump to conclusions from a very small number of cases one is acquainted with = anecdotal "evidence"...

    So, one must document the possible issues with it, look out for such potential problems but if most people are OK with it, then....

    Otherwise, this is reality...

    Covid-19 in the UK
    4.0% received at least one vaccine dose

    Daily cases
    47,525
    -14,797 v last week

    In hospital
    36,489
    +5,872 v last week

    Daily deaths
    1,564
    +523 v last week



    Dealing with death Covid's toll on UK crematoria and morgues as fatalities pass 100,000
    [​IMG]
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...global-daily-deaths-pass-17000-for-first-time

    Coronavirus live news: curfew in Brazil's largest state after surge in fatalities; record deaths in Sweden
    Claims an entire hospital wing of patients dies in Manaus after oxygen supply ran out; Sweden’s death toll goes past 10,000

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/14/brazil-manaus-amazonas-covid-coronavirus
    Nutters will inherit the kingdom of... whatever....
     
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  7. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Here is a "good" example of this lunacy...

    https://twitter.com/NeilDotObrien/status/1349701110588710916
    Neil O'Brien MP

    As the UK tragically hits a record number of Covid-19 deaths, Covid-sceptic-in-chief @toadmeister (Toby Young)
    appears to have deleted all his tweets from last year. That's not surprising. Here are some of the things he claimed over the last year - a thread.

    "Should we be worried about the uptick in cases? Almost certainly not. It’s due to recent increases in testing capacity... Given the over-sensitivity of the PCR test, the rise in new cases is telling us just how many people have had Covid-19 in the past"

    "as we sceptics are fond of pointing out, almost no one has the virus any more."

    "we were told... the number of infected people was on the rise again... the rise was due to a combination of increased testing and false positives."

    "The check-in process at Heathrow took at least four times longer than usual and having to wear a face nappy for the entire journey was a pain in the bum. But... in Venice things started to look up – I’d finally escaped Gulag Britain."

    "I may... convene a public inquiry of my own. The experts I’ll invite to sit on the panel won’t be the usual hacks with an axe to grind... They’ll be [like] Sunetra Gupta, the Oxford epidemiologist who believes we may have achieved herd immunity already"

    "The scientists predict a massive resurgence of Covid-19 infections if we don’t “get on top of things” and that part of the report is unconvincing... the paper seems pessimistic about the level of immunity that the UK population has already acquired."

    "I’m going to go out on a limb and predict there will be no “second spike” – not now, and not in the autumn either. The virus has melted into thin air. It’s time to get back to normal."

    Idiots!!!
     
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  8. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    @gorksi: I agree there is little beyond anecdotal evidence of the dog wormer in relation to COVID. And some medicines may have very limited applicability, for example only during a stage of the illness (hence the multi-medicine approach some scientists had talked about). Heck, even smoking tobacco might help at a certain stage of infection -- namely when one has just inhaled the virus particles and they are at the stage where they could be killed by direct contact with tobacco smoke :D It's weird, but I heard there is a vaccine now...
     
  9. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    ...half a dozen even.... :p alas we do not know how they affect the fringes of the population... yet... like your cousin... but there was no time for a more sober, careful, detailed analysis, ergo... :(
     
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  10. Tiger-1

    Tiger-1 MDL Guru

    Oct 18, 2014
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    I will not return here anymore it seems that this "thing" has no end ...;)
     
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  11. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #1871 Yen, Jan 15, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2021
    I did not spread misinformation. I studied the available Ivermectin studies (Ivermectin only studies) and came to a conclusion (which others share as well) that it is significantly working for COVID-19- This evaluation is even based on my profession (not just out of the wild). Also the mechanisms of actions are known. It is a livesaver for COVID-19.

    Unique adverse effects of drugs have to be considered to the unique situations and also if causality is proved. (Not only correlation).

    That all being said btw applies to the vaccines as well as to all other drugs.
    The company where I am working has to deal with contraindications all the time (just like any other pharmaceutical company).

    It is common sense that if a doc prescribes a drug he's doing it with best knowledge, anyway there is mostly a huge list of potential side effects. Because of that the doc mostly says try that and if you encounter side effects I'll prescribe a replacement drug. (At some drugs medical monitoring of blood values etc is mandatory).

    Ivermectin is used since the 80s and millions of people have taken it so far. It has got Nobel Price 2015 (the scientists for development) and has a well documented and long medical history compared to the new mRNA vaccines.
    It is on the list of World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines.

    I am sorry what happened. Maybe the physician who has prescribed it did a mistake and should not have done it. Yellow skin could indicate hepatic issues / bilirubin related.

    I know it has contraindication with alcohol and people where the blood brain barrier is not fully functioning or is not yet fully formed (babies). This also applies logically to pregnant / lactating women.
     
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  12. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    No doctor would prescribe that here for cancer which is what he uses it for, or for COVID for that matter. This is the thing, people read some forums or like my family member hire some alternative cancer coach who recommends it and just order it from a website somewhere. It is often not because they are so convinced it works for their purpose, it is because their true motivator is that they (for whatever reason) don't want to undergo conventional (and proven) treatments. In this case, it is prostate cancer that he has had for several years now. Recently, he got diagnosed for having cancer of the lips/mouth -- which, by the way, developed *as he was taking ivermectin.* But now he chose to do conventional cancer therapy of radiation -- while still not doing the same for his prostate cancer. Now, can imagine why he does not want to do chemo and radiation for his prostate? A lot of men are afraid to lose continence or sexual function. So you see, he went with ivermectin because his true motivator back then was not the method that was most likely to work and possibly save his life; his motivator was to preserver certain functions. And this is where things get dangerous. Some cancer coach who does not have cancer, telling people to use medicines like this.
     
  13. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    4,500 people diagnosed with COVID after getting 1st vaccine dose

    https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/294794

    Vaccines = lies
     
  14. parafer

    parafer MDL Member

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    Two doses are recommended. One does is administered. Logical conclusion is not: vaccine doesn't work. On top of this, high morbidity is ascribed to mutant strain for which the vaccine wasn't specifically designed. This article provides feedback on possible effects when only one dose of the vaccine is administered. All other assertions are not reasonable.
     
  15. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Thing is, well question is: how when where why someone in here is qualified to tag anything as misinformation...
     
  16. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #1876 Yen, Jan 15, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2021
    Thanks for posting details. I do have now a better understanding for this particular case.
    When a drug gets approved, it gets approved for a certain illness / treatment. Using it out of official approval for something else is actually a misuse.

    But it happens that an established drug also works for another sickness as shown in later research. For instance ketamine. This drug has also been abused on streets. It is traditionally used for starting and maintaining anaesthesia, but recent research showed that it is a good and fast working anti-depressive. So it got approval later as an anti-depressive with another dosage of course.

    (The laws for drugs are national, they can be different at other nations, not to forget).

    COVID-19 is new and to screen drugs we already have makes perfect sense.
    Generally you always have to evaluate the risk / benefit ratio properly.
    Cancer is hard. My dad has it as well. There are lots of people who do not follow the traditional medical way of treatment.
    And there are lots of crooks who offer 'alternatives' (Steve Jobs, who actually was pretty intelligent did also not follow the traditional ways and...).

    My dad takes oral chemo following a special dose plan. He sometimes darns those tablets when he's got adverse effects.
    Anyway the affected one should have the right to take alternative treatments, yeah even the right to take nothing, but being aware of all consequences.
    The affected one should ever have the feeling to have made the right decisions and not being fooled by somebody.

    Since I discovered some talent in Chemistry my 'dream' was to do something that relieves suffer from people. Not all stuff we have is good here in the company. But we developed some which are really useful and I am glad to be a part of their developments.

    My evaluation of Ivermectin is done with best knowledge. It is a lifesaver for COVID-19 and actually a shame that there are only a few ICUs who have it integrated into the COVID-19 treatment protocol yet.
    Once SARS-COV-2 has entered the cell and resides in the cytoplasm it has to disable defence mechanisms of the nucleus in order to capture it..
    It also disables the ability to 'warn' other cells that there is something strange going on.
    Ivermectin does block both successfully.

    It is for those who have got COVID-19 already and have the tendency to get a severe progress at first place.(It can also be used as prophylaxis, though)
    If my parents should get COVID-19 and get into a severe progress and Ivermectin wouldn't be allowed to use it for treatment I would take the responsibility and would give it to them if I could get some Ivermectin! The studies are really impressing so far. I would not do that if I am not with it with my heart. (And this applies to me as well. I also would take it).



    They do not suffer from covid, but from immune response in a more severe fashion. Anything is a risk / benefit evaluation and the question if one should accept that is always a valid question.
    For me ATM I say no to vaccination- That might change in the future, though.

    To tag anything as misinformation mostly is a personal related issue. One does not accept any information from a certain person / institution / group of people due to personal reasons only.
    'They', 'scientists', 'politicians', 'pharma industry' or a certain person.

    An information quickly can become a misinformation when it gets out of context.
    The mechanism is always when people leave to start arguing on content and move to arguing on the persons 'attributes' which are even not real, but assigned from the other one.
     
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  17. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Exactly. Then we should stop saying misinformation this or that for this discussion.
     
  18. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    ⚡️RT EXCLUSIVE: Germany to build a CAMP for COVID-dissidents

    Germany is getting proper authoritarian when it comes to policing its quarantine. It’s deemed it necessary to threaten violators with a stint in Covid jail. The facility will be based in Dresden, local police authorities have confirmed to RT.

    A spokesperson said access to the ‘pandemic hotel’ pictured here won’t be that easy – you need to get a warning and a fine first. It’ll be up to a court to decide if you qualify for a stay.

    "We don't assume that there will be very many, but in the event that a court decides that way, there will be a facility to accommodate them,” said the spokesperson.

    How convenient!

    https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/1350138428122427393?s=19
     
  19. case-sensitive

    case-sensitive MDL Expert

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    Nice one for the ' experts ' here ---- > Yesterday the BBC world service said ...... after 5 months of tests ...... that anyone who has hadf covid is imune and doesnt need a vacine .
     
  20. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #1880 Yen, Jan 16, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2021
    This makes perfect sense. I posted my opinion about that as well.
    The best protection one can have is a natural immunity due to infection. The annoying part is that COVID-19 may cause 'long-hauling' and even death.

    When you have been infected by SARS-COV-2 you do create antibodies not only for the spike protein. You create them for the entire virus.

    There are 3 kinds of antibodies: (besides of monoclonal and poly-clonal)
    -binding
    -neutralizing
    -sterilizing

    Binding: They just bind to somewhere at the virus's surface
    Neutralizing: They bind to for instance to the spike protein which has a function to enter the cells (just like a door opener). Once blocked replication is impossible.
    Sterilizing:They bind to the virus in that way that if it should be spread, it won't be contagious.

    From what we know so far:
    The vaccines do only create neutralizing antibodies against the S protein. The probability to get severe COVID-19 is almost 0. Infection might still occur. And you might be still contagious then.

    The real infection creates binding and neutralizing antibodies against the entire virus, not only the S protein, a re-infection with asymptomatic progress can occur. Means SARS-COV-2 positive: yes, COVID-19: no.

    When being symptomatic at first time, you are contagious. When being infected the second time you are asymptomatic and not contagious due to a low viral load.
     
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