If God is Omniscient then Human is not free.

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by sid_16, Apr 9, 2013.

?

Free will doesn't exist If God is omniscient.

  1. If yes, why?

    36 vote(s)
    45.0%
  2. If no, then how?

    44 vote(s)
    55.0%
  1. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    #1301 SOCRATE_MMXII, Oct 13, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2015
    :laie: :laie: :laie: :laie: :laie:

    Definitions, huh... :g:

    P.S. Just for the fun of it, dear TCM please describe an object from 9D. Let's see if you can do this. Please don't point to some useless mathematical equation to do it, but use your own words.
    Have fun!
     
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  2. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    One should do a study on the ratio of retarded smilies vs. tangible post content.
     
  3. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    #1303 TCM, Oct 13, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2015
    What's the point? I'm not claiming that anything like a 9D space with powerful beings exists. My inability to describe 9D without math adds nothing to the validity of any claim.

    Edit: In other words, you can't just logically put your claim into unimaginable realms and then try to validate it by the inability of someone else to describe your own made-up realm. If it is not imaginable for humans, how do you know about it to even make the claim? It just doesn't work that way.
     
  4. Yen

    Yen Admin
    Staff Member

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    If one has a special idea of god, god (he/she) becomes (an idol).
    You are pointing on the suffer the human concept of god has created and is still creating.

    It sounds more like BS than it is.

    "having infinite awareness, understanding, and insight "

    "possessed of universal or complete knowledge "

    The valid questions are: Can an entity that is tied to time have those attributes at all?
    Do the quoted bits mean can predict one's future?

    Before thinking about one should probably think about the reality of the future at all.
     
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  5. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Yes, Yen, there is a linguistic problem now, certainly... Sorry but it's a wee bit unintelligible as to what you are trying to say, especially as these subjects are a bit "ethereal" by default and so one little misunderstanding and everything is "off"... And right now your sentences (at least the second one) has no linguistic meaning. Not that you don't have an idea that has sense but - better one asks for clarification, before one "attacks"... ;) I hate that, so trying not to do it myself... :)

    Generally speaking my problem would be - IF I understood correctly - is there such a thing as "non-special" understanding of God? I mean, can you really remove the subject from it? I don't think so. In fact, this is the real problem that needs a lot of working on, lots of mutual good will etc. One can't forget we are formed by lots of education etc. Then, personal experiences, then individual capabilities, from basic ones to linguistic etc.

    So, WTF are you about this time, please? :D :D :D
     
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  6. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    This shows you your limits. Thank you.

    The realms are unimaginable just for you. Again...your limitations.
     
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  7. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    #1307 TCM, Oct 14, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2015
    And you don't have these limits? I rest my case.

    Where is your proof? Exactly, there is none. So instead of acknowledging that you know just as much as any human about these "realms" (which is jack s**t), you claim they exist despite the lack of any evidence. Very believable...
     
  8. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    Nope, I don't have those limits.

    :laie: :laie: :laie:
    You're so funny, you know that?

    My proof is...out of this dimension.
    Again: a 4D brain cannot process the existence of 9D, let alone the acknowledgement of a being in the nth dimension. You just can't accept this statement, because this statement is outside your comfort zone (aka the devil you know it's better that the devil you don't know). This statement puts you to work...within and that's a "scary thing" for the majority today.

    "Sky is not the limit. Your mind is." ;)
     
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  9. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    Whatever experiences you have on whatever drugs you take, it's only in your head, in that lump of biomass called a brain. It has no connection whatsoever to the outside reality.

    So no, you don't know anything about it, you only think you know. By definition, you can't know anything about something that is not experiencable. Making stuff up is not knowledge.
     
  10. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    Trolling is addictive...:rolleyes::D:p
     
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  11. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    You and pretty much all the humanity forgot one crucial thing that stops your evolution: the mind is a sense. It's the sixth sense. It's not what you think it is. Not at all, thus your limitation.
     
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  12. R29k

    R29k MDL GLaDOS

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    And you know the secret right since you're not part of humanity :laie: I call bollocks.
     
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  13. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    If you read my post carefully, you'll notice I said: "pretty much all the humanity". That's no secret. At all, but most can't accept that, 'cause if they would, that would cause a shift in consciousness on a global scale...then no religion, no capitalism, no borders, no armies, no wars...but PEACE, JOY and HAPPINESS.
     
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  14. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    No, that is not the point! Time and time again you can't/won't see the elementary critique sent your way... Trolling happily...

    So, here it is, in plain language...

    The point is: what gives you the right to set yourself apart and judge like that, from on high? What exactly have you achieved, studied, so long and hard, at such a high level, how come you are so exalted? By which magic were you given this acknowledgement? By whom? Which institution, which wise-guy? Which "inner circle" of "exalted Humanity" gives you the right and tools by which you are not of the "uninitiated", the "great unwashed", as it were...???

    Bah...
     
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  15. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    Quiet, infidel! Don't you see this is new-age humbleness?
     
  16. nodnar

    nodnar MDL Expert

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    infidel. seriously, mind your language please...
     
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  17. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    I am nothing, unless I am THE infidel - or my name isn't Salman!!!:rolleyes::p:D:biggrin::clap:
     
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  18. TCM

    TCM MDL Addicted

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    Go get a dictionary.

    PS: And a sarcasm detector.
     
  19. SOCRATE_MMXII

    SOCRATE_MMXII MDL Expert

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    Dear gorski, you just can't accept it. You will...eventually. If not in this life, then in the next...

    :laie: :laie: :laie:
    What movie have you seen lately?
     
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  20. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    I think you're watching Mel Gibson movies... :rolleyes::D:biggrin::clap:
     
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