W7 RTM couldn't become a nightmare since it was actually the final version of Vista, W7 has no major kernel update. All Vista customers got a beta OS even though the OEMs signed it off for RTM. Btw: The voting almost has failed. M$ has forced them to come to an agreement. In fact there still remained disagreement and discontent. The one who had to suffer was the customer who has bought Vista, even more at the 64 bit version. When triple channel support came up (btw another marketing gag of OEMs) you had to choose 3*1GB , which was not much for Vista, or better 3*2 GB. To address 6GB you need a 64 bit OS. But for the 64 bit OS the OEMs simply didn't make the effort to develop drivers. So most of them couldn't use their hardware anymore (such as soundcards, scanner, wlan stick). So they got even more upset. I remind those times very well and I laughed about those who had bought Vista 64 bit. It's sometimes smarter to keep the old OS. But some don't seem to get that. To have a reason to tell their friends to have always the newest stuff, even a leak, is more important to them. I also think w8 will be the next Vista, but the reasons will be different. It’s not the lack of drivers, or the start of the 64 bit era. Also no technical issues. W8 also has got no major kernel update. What is w8 actually? It’s an improved w7 wrapped into a stolen idea. To keep up to date, to be with the ones who already enjoy apps. But apps and corporate OS doesn’t fit. M$ will fail with that hence it’ll become another Vista. Vista = something nobody really needs. Only a few will buy this to play with 2 dimensional tiles, to use a stolen idea. The M$ market will fail, because nobody is interested in. The volunteers are already at the apps store / market. Unless M$ baits them with money (oh I have forgotten they do that already, they call it app competition), nobody really cares about windows apps. True individuals with a strong ideology remain at the free Android community. Others who are money-grubbing are Apple app store developers / paid app developer already. Maybe a few of them move to M$, it depends how much M$ will pay errm offer for it. Betrayers of a originally good idea (small free progs = apps) are found everywhere. Add: I have to admit some are even found in the android community already. (You have to push the donate button if you want my stuff)..bad world..maybe those move away then when w8 became RTM...
I guessed me and a few million others is a "NOBODY". I think I can no longer take you seriously. And I guessed Android isn't the BIGGEST stolen idea from Windows and iOS.
It sickens me to see so many people covet android. It's GOOGLE after all. You know, the people who's sole goal is to make money off of marketing you to ad agencies. They are making money off your data. The more you covet them, the more info you give them and the more money you make them. I refuse to use a google browser, google+, or any android fone, especially since they (and apple) are fine with Carrier IQ. Me being a freedom loving American, I cannot morally use or advise anyone to use, google or apple products. Why give money to the companies that are handing over every single bit of info and details about you to the National Security Administration and ad agencies? Yes, you are being spied on by the government if you use android or apple fones.
The real point of all the criticism of Metro as a user interface, is that the majority of posters are afraid that the traditional user interface that Windows 7 has will go away with Windows 8. Relax - the traditional UI (from Windows 7) is going exactly nowhere. What we're actually going to have is something that is, in fact, foreign to the general Windows community (but is commonplace in Linux distributions and even UNIX) - a UI choice. Metro as a UI isn't for everyone - and nobody that likes it (including me) has said that it is. Metro is an optional UI for all Windows 8 hardware - use it only if you want to. The traditional UI (Windows 7-ish) will still be there. (There may, in fact, be tablet and slate users that prefer it. Let's look at the SAMSUNG Series 7 - the very same slate that Microsoft handed out at BUILD. It wasn't developed with Windows 8 in mind - it started shipping last year, armed with - surprise - Windows 7. It ships with Windows 7 as the default today. Not Android. Not iOS. Yet the Series 7 sells. That tells me that not even all tablet users want a touch-enabled OS, even on a tablet/slate. And if tablet/slate users can, and will, use a non-touch-enabled traditional OS - traditional UI and all - on a tablet or slate - which is certainly the case with the Series 7 - why is the reverse improbable or impossible?) It's not FUD - that would imply there is uncertainty or doubt involved. The traditional UI will still be there. Traditional applications will still work as they always have. The difference with Windows 8 is that there is a UI option - for users that want one. The FEAR that all the Metro-haters have - that the traditional UI is in trouble - is absolutely groundless *and* baseless.
You are a free person and can take me as you want. It would be strange when all the members here have the same opinions. BTW: I have never said google / Android has never stolen a thing. Isn't it strange that the US Americans who say that they love freedom actually have these companies who treat privacy with content? Apple M$ Facebook Google I live in the EU which has to sentence some of them already because of that and abusing free market politics. In my country privacy is respected. But you are right with your concerns. I wanted to have a smart phone. So I had a look what I can get. I have chosen Android. When you are an active part of the 'electronic' society you are faced with privacy issues. Another way would be to deny to be a part of it completely. Everybody has sources which report of privacy and how companies deal with it. It begins with your IP and how your ISP / phone provider handles it and ends with buying apps from your favorite app store / facebook profile. To me important is that everybody is sceptical and makes up his mind by informing. Since I wanted a smart phone I have chosen android for my personal reasons. I can turn off google services and the OS asks me when enabling that info gets passed to google. Also I find there people who are thinking the same and there is a strong modification community. I also have sources which analyzes data contents in the aspect of privacy. Scandals had been revealed already concerning Apple and M$. Also google, but it was not android related. The question is not how to choose one which treats your privacy as it IMHO should. The question is how to choose the one with you can comply most. This is sad but true. Some of your remarks seem to me a little paranoid though. Which government should spy on me? Phones are sold all over the world and believe me there are governments who still haven't the power just to do what they want.....they are controlled. In that aspect I should add that in most countries phones / providers must provide the technical posibility that the 'officials' can record any phone call you make if a judge orders to monitor a peárticular person. I bet the USA secret services are well known for that. I have no problem if the intention to do so is to fight terrorism, but I have a problem when the mentioned US American companies greed for money by creating consume profiles. Their only idea to do so is to find the most effective way to get money of us people. Money is poison and all the cause for disrespecting privacy. Hence I use Android which is based on Linux, where you can get all the source code. It is a open and free OS where everybody can develop using their sources. M$ and Apple is different. This is the big difference. Everybody can study the code ALSO regarding privacy. M$'es idea to go for apps is nothing but the greed for money. I don't say google is different in that aspect, but at least I have a open source OS on my phone where its code can be easily analyzed.
Excellent reply Yen. Simply Excellent. The phrase 'money is the root of all evil' is taking things to a whole new level these days with the amount of corporate greed and espionage around the world. I guess I should rephrase my statement to "mankind sickens me". lol
I said this in the loader thread. Before anyone says anything I'm well aware that the final version of Windows 8 might have the start menu from Windows 7 as an option, but as I've said, why would I want to be running an extra UI layer in the background that I won't ever use? On a tablet that I browse the web, play movies and listen to music on I'm sure I'd like the metro UI but when I'm doing "serious work" I multitask like crazy and Windows 8 really becomes annoying at that point. If I were to use Windows 8 with everything metro disabled then I'd just be left with a dull squared looking Windows 7
Dont like windows 8 so much myself, then again i did not like xp, vista, win7, but ended up using them anyway !! MS are trying to make W8 too easy to use and that just takes all the fun away !!
It is good to see that there are others who are thinking about. Sometimes I feel plain stupid if I try to argue like that. You can have it even more generic. It is the ego that greeds. I have once written an article. It has been about to determine a generic mechanism of history of mankind. The ego is the generic power to create cultures, technology, advancement, but it has been always and will be the reason for their doom. (We know that there were already highly developed cultures on earth which vanished) Modesty is the moderator. To enjoy to share if one can. To be enjoyed if one is happy who got help without to have to give something in return. Also to enjoy the simple things in life. We are influenced by advertisements, telling us we need to consume, to have something to feel good. Sometimes it's better to keep all our devices switched off. To go outside and to enjoy the nature, familly, friends. To enjoy life, to communicate verbally not through facebook. I try to pay attention to get what happens in the world. And no I do not measure everything by the same yardstick. I want to mention Bill Gates founder of M$. A very rich person and once a top businessman. He spends his money because of humanitarian reasons. Recently it seems those persons are rare though. I guess he simply has got what real richness means. It's a simple equation. If there are places where money accumulates it has to lack somewhere. Since we are living in a capitalistic world, money is the value for goods, also for goods which make life possible (food, medicine). Bill knows that if he would keep all the money it is actually worthless. He has spent for Malaria research. Companies such as Apple and Google would gain much reputation if they would give something back they actually don't need. To be at the consumer side, we just can think if we need every time everything that is new. To keep back on topic, at least a bit. This is also a reason why I'll skip w8, I do not really need it, it is made to be a money making machine.
And that is precisely the issue, Daz. I get why you think the way you do - you are used to (dare I say it) the traditional development method (especially for a UI) - match the UI to a device, as opposed to a task. The result of that sort of thinking is niche UIs, niche operating systems, UI forks, and fracturing of effort - and all that is just for developers. For users, you wind up with multiple devices, each with a different UI (or worse, a different OS) and *transition fatigue* (between devices, their UIs, and their operating systems) - how is any of that good? Daz - do you ever run a browser (any browser, not necessarily IE) in *kiosk* mode? Do you run any applications full-screen? (I'm not referring to Visual Studio or any other IDE - most of those are full-screen by default.) Not everyone computes (even on traditional hardware) the same way - so why is the idea of a UI option (not just in Windows 8, but versions of Windows beyond 8) a bad thing? That is all that Metro is - an option. There is more than enough computing power there (unless you are deliberately underpowering your hardware) for the additional UI code weight to be pretty much irrelevant for most users. Even Metro's detractors admit that there's no performance lag between 8102 and 7989 (and the UI is, in fact, the only real difference between the two). Daz, my point is that there is no indication or even hint - from anybody - that the traditional UI won't appear in Windows 8. Metro in Windows 8 is like Luna was in Windows XP (or Royale - the skinned Luna, was in XP Media Center Edition) - a different face. Daz - the very reason why we would be left with basically Windows 7 with minor fixes is, when it comes to the traditional UI, nobody wants to change anything - not really. Why else is it *still* the case that Windows maintains multiple separate/separated control panels when the mechanism for unifying them (Microsoft Management Console, which goes back to Windows 2000 in current form) has existed to fix it? MMC was designed *specifically* to solve panel overload. It's not *one-size-fits-all* - it has a snap-in standard - it's not even hostile to foreign snap-ins. Yet it remains deliberately underused and underutilized - by developers and users alike. Some of that plethora of panels is actually *duplicated* in MMC snap-ins (Device Manager, for example) - yet the separate example remains (even when the snap-in version, which is certainly the case with Device Manager, is not only far superior, but far more useful). YOu thinking the way you do is understandable and works for you. Still, because usability differs for each user, why is user UI choice (especially when the cost is nil) problematical?
Different people have different needs and compute in different ways. You could say that HTML5 is the new development method, but I say that's never going to be true because that's really just smoke and mirrors and there's a lot of backend work to be done for any real program that doesn't plan on using .NET framework. I never use a browser in fullscreen mode as I personally can't stand it. I will maximize, re-size or minimize things what seems like every 10 minutes depending on what I'm doing. Having the taskbar is an absolute must so that I can quickly click on what I want (1 click vs alt + tab until I get to where I want to go). Also I hate audio alerts and I like things to be visual, which is another reason why I like the taskbar. No matter what I do with Metro it's either taking up all of my screen or it's making me press a lot more buttons to get to where I want to go. It's slowing down productivity. That's the problem Windows 8 will have with businesses too, because do you think businesses care about some HTML5 applications that Microsoft is going to try to sell to people from their store? Honestly, most companies will either disable Metro or simply not use Windows 8. What I don't get is how people say Metro is a faster way to navigate. Metro and Windows 7 can both pin 2 applications side by side, but in Windows 7 you can also layer more on top Plus if I wanted to quickly search for an application I can either click the start button or press the Windows key and still see every application I have open. Also I make use of desktop shortcuts, pinned applications and aero peek. And if I cared to receive any "live" information then I could install a few widgets and just use aero peek to view them, which would require no button or key presses. Windows 8 for developers, or should I say cross platform developers, sucks. And as I've said above, I believe businesses will avoid it and use Windows 7 until they have Windows 8 forced down their throats.
i myself will not be using windows 8,like you said daz,smoke and mirrors from microsoft,pure crap,propaganda,people are treating windows 8 like the second coming or something like that,i myself think that windows xp is more than capable of handling everyday tasks like email,browsing,development,you know,the real purpose of an operating system
Windows XP is enough for some people, but Windows 7 improves on that further due to the widgets and the things you can do with aero. How long do you think it will be until Microsoft start saying that you can use Kinect to navigate the Windows 8 UI? They'll get a lot of the kids on board and have them saying it's like minority report It's just another gimmick. During installation when it says "Welcome to Windows 8" Microsoft needs to add a prompt that asks the user if they want the new look or the classic look. Automatically switching to the Metro UI for desktop users without touchscreens would be a huge mistake IMO.
Metro ui is the most beautiful, elegant, slick, smooth, productive, fast, gorgeous and the greatest ui of all time. Anyone who doesn't like metro is a luddite, backward, ignorant and knows zero about technology. Windows 8 is the greatest innovation in the history of computing