So I've used the horrible Windows 8 for a month....

Discussion in 'Windows 8' started by ian82, Mar 17, 2013.

  1. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    May 6, 2007
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    I work in a Pharmaceutical company. The IT administration is responsible which general software will be purchased and running on the local network. They have decided to run M$ server and w7 as clients. Also exchange servers, all are M$ products.
    Each client has office installed, so everybody of us has a basic installation of w7 with office.


    These are around 2000 clients. The administrative IT section and M$ have made a unique licensing model concerning the company with a unique offer and costs.

    Since I am a scientist and have to work with special devices I have to use special applications besides of the usual office stuff.
    Each of us visits workshops and learns how to use these applications and how to program unique add-ons for special scientific measurements.

    I also use Photoshop since I am a photographer. (I use it also to record experiments, to workout photos).

    I am with computers since 1982 and I know many products and many companies.

    There are companies who have a close relationship to the end user, better said to the needs of the end user. And there are companies which simply don’t have that, or don’t care and even worse they have different workgroups of programmers which aren’t work well together. The result is an application with a bad workflow and inconvenient to use.

    M$ always were late in development and pedestrian. When I needed spreadsheet software to calculate results I had to use “AS-EASY-AS” then Lotus 1-2-3.
    Then sigmaplot. Excel? Forget about. Where was it???
    The same had been with simple text editors.
    MS word? Forget about!

    M$ had been always too late and bumped their better competitors off the market even though the competitors had the far more developed products.
    Windows an invention of M$? Ha-ha. The commodore Amiga had the workbench with windows ages ago.
    I could name more such stories. Without M$ the entire IT and PC tech world would have reached a far more developed state. This is my observation since 1982. And I have many arguments for that.

    Their products today have a bad workflow and are not very productive.
    People are forced to use them because everybody uses them and have no alternatives to remain compatible.
    Major issues of e.g. Excel 2007 were not fixed a long time.

    Also concerning special measurement software I can clearly differentiate which company makes excellent applications which are effective, productive and user friendly and which are not.
    For instance Dionex makes good applications (dionex chromeleon) and others such as EZChrom Elite suck.

    I myself find Adobe products have a very good workflow and are well-conceived. They look very complicated at first sight but after a few hours of a lesson one learns quickly..
     
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  2. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    The normal worker in an Company, even if well educated but trained from beginning to work with computers, will have need quite a bit of time for to get use of it. Years ago it were even more bad.

    A trained scientist, even coming from an different area, will have much less problem to get things done than an normal person because he's trained to solve things in various way.

    Could we compare that persons knowledge? No, I don't think so! I work since beginning of the 70' with computers and the first was an SDS Sigma 7 which my first employer owned and were located at 2 stories in our Company Building in Hongkong! Since I've seen a lot changes and also have learned a lot: to work with computers and to work with the people who using that computers.



    For sure I had my good times and my bad times and have done a lot mistakes as well. One of the biggest mistakes I done the first few years, was not to listen to the users, I was expecting that they have to listen to me and also that they were able to do the same as I did regarding the daily work on that intelligent machines. I learned from that that firstly those machines are everything but intelligent! I also learned that I'm same stupid as those machines because I trusted them.

    It was my boss, an 92 year old Chinese man who was educated in philosophy who was bring me back on my feet's. He teached me a lot of lessons and one of them was to listen to the people who have to work with me and never expecting that those will have the same knowledge as I. Even I was the boss of the Computer Department of that company, I was forced to listen to the workers and work with them together and not let them work for me (or for the company)!

    What I learned in that company, the only one I ever were employed to, has fully value till today. Since 1984 I rum my own Company doing service for Computer Networks and also run as outsourced service the IT Departments in a few companies in Thailand with a total of near 9k computers. From my staff 14 are working since 1984 for me and the youngest already 6 years now. It were not allways fun time, I also had a few downtimes, one not so long ago and those case is still running on court.

    But what was the main lesson I'd learned from that all? Never use my knowledge as weight against my employees or those I have to work with, listen first to them and then try to find an for both/all sites working solution. Also learned not to try to push those people to a new area from which they didn't know anything, no, start to build on the available knowledge. I also learned to be all times polite and accepting that those other people having the same human right as I claim for myself. And I learned that I should no accept more from others as I'm willing to give to them.

    That al has very little to do with computers and software, I know, it was only to explain my way of thing and how I like to handle upcoming problems.

    So, back to software! I would not force my own Employees or those of my customers for to use what I think would be the best for them. I would let them chose on their own after have demonstrated what I was thinking should be changed or would be better. I also listen to them if they come with some inquiry or wishes of change. That applies for Operating Systems like Windows or Application Software or whatever is needed. I also try to find the best and cheapest way for upgrading, if an upgrade is really need. What I was write in the pother post about Excel, the upgrade from Office XP and 2007 to Office 2010, has saved a lot by 2 of my biggest customers. And so will the upgrade to Office 2013! Also the change of some application from old Adobe Suite to others like Vertus Fluid Mask and so, has saved quite a bit of money for mu customers beside that the designers are now working much more efficient!

    I'm not using MS Software for everything, I use a lot other Apps. What we and therefore I using is what we really need and to be able to flawlessly work with without the need to invest a lot of time for new learning the new stuff. Don't forget, I talking from normal computer users and not from you and I! You and I we would have much less time to invest than the normal user's because we do think a different way!

    Hope that makes myself a bit more clear.

    Thanks for taken the time to reading.

    Cheers.
     
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  3. Fast-007

    Fast-007 MDL Novice

    Jul 12, 2009
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    this thread started as:
    So I've used the horrible Windows 8 for a month....

    and it have end to:
    Yen VS pisthai ......
     
  4. msr

    msr MDL Senior Member

    Dec 27, 2007
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    Just say i am glad i am staying with win7. I have tried out windows server 2012 for last day and do not like the interface, i assume win8 is the same.

    Making a tablet version of windows server, why....
     
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  5. Fast-007

    Fast-007 MDL Novice

    Jul 12, 2009
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    M$ "one size fits all" fail ...

    if you like windows 7 style, stay with it, unless you want to have a windows 8 frankenbuild that looks like windows 7 ...

    windows 8 it's not better, neighter faster, neighter more stable than windows 7 ..

    windows 8 is just for make more money with a monopolistic app system called metro style.....



    .
     
  6. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    Sorry if you see it wrong!

    That's just a friendly discussion, like such should be all times, without show off's etc. between some normal thinking and imperfect humans!

    We all, doesn't matter what system or OS we're using, having our own experiences which will differs from those others having. And that's just good so. So, jusy leave it by that and don't try to bring something is what isn't there.

    Thanks.
     
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  7. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    If you think that Windows 7 fits for you, it's just fine. Stay with it and say bye bye to Windows 8 and don't come back!

    And if you start talking from an monopolistic app system, you should talk about Apple's OS and there you were right! What they doing is what you tell: monopolistic!
     
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  8. sebus

    sebus MDL Guru

    Jul 23, 2008
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    Startisback does not make frankenbuild, it makes Win8 usable
     
  9. eydee

    eydee Guest

    If you think a bit, people do talk about Apple the same way and there are Apple fanboys just like there are MS fanboys out there to defend their gods. Both companies are (or trying to be) monopolistic. The big difference is that Apple makes quality (even if terribly overpriced) and people do buy their stuff and they are successful and make more money than we can imagine. MS on the other hand is not successful with W8 at all and if it was their only money source, they would have gone bankrupt very quickly. Yes, there are people who like W8 but if you look at statistics, most hate it.

    Actually it is a good thing. Not because MS has to be hated or similar nonsense. It's good because it moves people's attention towards other (mostly open source) operating systems. It makes competition and it is best for us, end users.
     
  10. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    Maybe you haven't understand what I was talking about!

    Monopolistic is meaning that someone didn't allows other to use them Product and that's exactly what Apple is doing!

    It isn't allowed to use OS-X or iOS on different systems than build (or branded if you like) from or for Apple. So, any use of an OS-X used on an other than Apple supplied Hardware as example, isn't allowed and against the law!


    Windows you can use on any system which is possible to get working with it, that includes to run on Apple product's, is allowed!

    That's just a simple example what monopolistic is all about!
     
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  11. jayblok

    jayblok MDL Guru

    Dec 26, 2010
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    can't we all just get along.

    ^_^
     
  12. EFA11

    EFA11 Avatar Guru

    Oct 7, 2010
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    Quality is in the eye of the beholder. lol

    Apple is a kin to Consoles, software is written to specific specs (their specs), where as MS Windows is attempting to be written to a huge amount of different specs such as home brewed systems, where the person adds whatever they choose to the system and not a specific set that MS decides they can use. There's an almost impossible amount of specs to support. Windows supports the majority of system setups out there, including many legacy, where as Apple doesn't /wont.

    With that said, one aught not confuse monopoly with a new version of Windows that is not forced upon you. You have choices on your system and its software. What you choose to use is up to you.
     
  13. Fast-007

    Fast-007 MDL Novice

    Jul 12, 2009
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    i'ts funny that you give me the same advice i give to all others, "if you like Windows 7 stay with it" , what i don't do is invite people to don't come back...

    and yes we can talk about many monopolistic system not only apple, but this thread is about M$ Windows 8 ...

    have a nice day you too ..


    .
     
  14. ancestor(v)

    ancestor(v) Admin
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    Jun 26, 2007
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    I deleted the last postings I considered unnecessary. Please discuss your personal issues per PM ... if you want to discuss any other topic than the one in this thread please open up a separate thread.
     
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  15. pisthai

    pisthai Imperfect Human

    Jul 29, 2009
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    It's funny! I answered to an post in an gracious and polite form to some statement given by others and that isn't OK? Or is it kind censor?
     
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  16. PGHammer

    PGHammer MDL Senior Member

    Oct 14, 2011
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    BS? Hardly. BS to individual users? Certainly.

    The insistence on Start menu bring-backs by particular users (and the market for them) merely indicates that some users (not half the Windows 8 user base, let alone the entirety of it) still need the features it offers. I don't have a problem with that, even though I use Windows 8 sans such add-ons. That is something that Windows *in general* has never had a problem with - adapting to how individual users work.

    The insistence on *only one way*, however, is so anti-Windows as to be laughable.

    Just because Windows 8 has no Start menu by default does not mean it has forgotten those of us that use keyboards and mice - if it did, how is it that many of us (even on MDL) use Windows 8 daily on desktops?

    Further, if the Start menu is so important, how is it that Windows Server 2012 also banished it?

    Just because some feature is important to a user or group of users, assuming that it's important to EVERY user is a reach.
     
  17. EFA11

    EFA11 Avatar Guru

    Oct 7, 2010
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    Without the start button, my windows key has gained a function rarely used. It felt lonely for years, now it feels useful again. I am happy for the lil'guy
     
  18. PGHammer

    PGHammer MDL Senior Member

    Oct 14, 2011
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    If anything, I use the Windows key more (not less) with the Start menu banished - because there are now other reasons to use it besides the Start menu.

    Part of my issues with the Start menu is that it tended to get in the way when I wanted to use another feature that was not even IN the Start menu. (Remember, the default function for the Windows key was to launch the Start menu.)

    From Windows 7 back, the Start menu acted as a gatekeeper - you HAVE to go through it to do anything with the Windows logo key.

    The StartScreen (Windows 8) doesn't act like that - which is a real relief for this keyboard/mouse user. That is why I don't complain about the StartScreen getting in the way.