What do you think about Electric Cars?

Discussion in 'Serious Discussion' started by Katzenfreund, Aug 24, 2017.

?

Will your next car be electric?

  1. My next car will be electric

  2. I’ll wait several years for prices to drop

  3. I’m not convinced by them, I’ll buy conventional

  4. I am undecided, far more info is required

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Katzenfreund

    Katzenfreund MDL Expert

    Jul 15, 2016
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    Having read the recent posts about long battery changing and queues at the stations, it seems to me the (I dare say only) practical way would be to charge in home garage overnight. The charger costs to be added to the purchase price.

    As for super-heavy vehicles, electric is not yet for them.
     
  2. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

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    What if you're a taxi driver doing so many miles you need to charge during the day?

    Or a salesman driving up and down the country all day?

    Batteries suck, they always have, we need a different type of fuel cell before they start using electric vehicles

    The only people who won't have too much of a problem are commuters who basically just do a 10 mile trip to work and back each day, and remember to charge at night

    Everyone else will hate them
     
  3. Katzenfreund

    Katzenfreund MDL Expert

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    As I indicated in the last para of my post, electric is not yet for everybody, no single type of car is even now. This doesn't mean they are not suitable for the majority of ordinary personal/family car users. After all, is an internal combustion engine suitable for moving suitcases inside an airport? Or for a fork lift inside a closed store room?

    As for professional taxi drivers, they may afford a second battery, most probably tax free, for interchanging.
     
  4. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

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    We're not talking about vehicles for moving suitcases indoors, or a forklift, we're talking about replacing the internal combustion engine with electric / battery powered

    Buying a second battery is not an option IMO, and after thinking about it yesterday, the batteries are pretty much part of the car and would not be an option to even switch them over at a charge point, they are basically built into the car and used for balance and other structural things, ridiculously heavy

    Not something the average person could change, it would be like switching your engine / fuel tank etc

    Electric vehicles will have their heyday, then they will cause all manor of problems and they'll go back where they belong out of sight, same as VR did for many decades

    The world is ready for electric vehicles, batteries are not
     
  5. Katzenfreund

    Katzenfreund MDL Expert

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    We’re talking about vehicles with engines. And in analogy to examples where electric wouldn't be a good choice, I gave examples where the ICE wouldn't and electric motors are taken for granted (to the extent that you exclude them). But in any case, I gave further examples of personal/family vehicles that would be served fine with battery, irrespective of what applies to other categories.

    Seeking “what if” situations that won’t work with batteries doesn't prove anything. With such “argumentation”, electricity itself might be claimed useless, with the statement, “What if someone lives in the middle of nowhere with no access to electricity?"

    Well, whoever isn't served well by the electric motor will stay on the ICE. And whoever has no access to electricity supply will use lamps etc. But plenty of people can be (and are) served by electric cars and plenty do have access to electricity supply.

    Please note that I am not claiming electric cars are better, after all I started this thread for discussing and hopefully finding out. What I am claiming is that “What if” special categories or exceptions don’t prove anything.
     
  6. Yen

    Yen Admin
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    #46 Yen, Sep 10, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
    A taxi driver in Berlin drives around 90000 km per year that is around 250 km per day. And one charge during lunch break is also possible.
    Recent batteries can go double per charge already...

    This source (unfortunately German, technical University) presumes 150 km only and a change to e taxis possible in Berlin.

    http://www.ingenieur.de/Themen/Elek...lt-Umstellung-Elektrobetrieb-fuer-realistisch
     
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  7. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #47 gorski, Sep 10, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
    There are EV buses on the roads everywhere around the world already...

    I have given CONCRETE examples of EVs in ICY and SNOW-LADEN conditions....

    I have given concrete evidence of EVs going on for a long time with only a few % drops in battery charge...

    I have... Oh, shoot, would you just read and SEE my long post above... I have been informing myself for a long time now, since I am aiming at buying either hybrid or EV next... There are FACTS there that DEMOLISH many "sceptical" positions demonstrated in this thread!!! But oh no...
     
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  8. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    #48 gorski, Sep 10, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
    My word, you Amuuuricans never heard of "break" as in "lunch break"?!? "Oh, what if a taxi driver has to recharge during the day..."

    Guess what: he is human, has to eat, go to the toilet, take a break. Besides, not easy to drive 500km per day, is it?

    EDIT: Yen has beaten me to it... :D :D :D DInd't see it when I was writing mine... :)
     
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  9. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    My word: Guess what, we all know that Captain Obvious. :p
     
  10. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

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    "What If" is very necessary because "what if's" are very common scenarios, at the end of the day as I've already said, everything that takes batteries sucks ass, batteries in general suck ass, having to charge batteries sucks ass, we already have an amazing engine and fuel, going all electric is a step backwards, it's something that (If batteries had have been better) would have been before the ICE, and the ICE would have made electric vehicles obsolete, this move is nothing more than some pointless government BS that will in some way or other line the fat cats pockets even more

    Guaranteed this will not last long, maybe a couple of years until it starts costing so much in problems, batteries, battery manufacturing and disposal, and constant breakdowns that need more than a can of petrol to solve

    And btw, I read/watched somewhere that it is more damaging to the environment to manufacture one of these electric vehicles and it's batteries, than it is driving an ICE car for 20 years
     
  11. MrMagic

    MrMagic MDL Guru

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    Taxi drivers get a 3-4 hour lunch break?

    A typical electric car (Nissan LEAF 30kWh) takes 4 hours to charge from empty with a 7kW home charging point.

    Pretty sure I wouldn't want to be sitting in a charging station for my lunch every day, or do you ask a friend who has a real car to come pick you up while it charges?
     
  12. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    MrMagic, you are a real laugh of a troll! :D

    For umpteenth time: batteries already go over 500KM!!!

    Here, the conclusion, for intellectually and spiritually lazy and ill-informed: taxi drivers do not need to recharge during the day!! :D

    Superchargers do NOT take 3-4 hours, you ignoramus with "hard opinions": https://www.tesla.com/supercharger?redirect=no - 1 hour is more than enough!

    In short, you know NOTHING but pretend you know everything, including the future... My word... What a larf! :D
     
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  13. gorski

    gorski MDL Guru

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    You know nathin'... :D
     
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  14. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Says Mr. Slang Shorthand... :D
     
  15. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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  16. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Jokes apart, wish I had that kind of food nearby to run there and yummy! yummy! :movingtongue:
     
  17. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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    Not the same anymore. 25 years ago it was Awesome. :drool:
    EDIT: It shows you how much we take for granted. I'm guilty of that same thing.

    If I could, I'd fedex you some Nathans dogs and fries, just so you children could experience it. :)
     
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  18. Mr.X

    Mr.X MDL Guru

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    Thanks anyway. Kiddos would love those...
     
  19. Tiger-1

    Tiger-1 MDL Guru

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  20. Michaela Joy

    Michaela Joy MDL Crazy Lady

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    Sorry for hijacking the thread. (not really... :D )

    It seems it's a half-full / half-empty argument. We are discussing a new technology.

    There's an old saying. "Necessity is the mother of invention"

    As older folks tend to stay focused on the past, and what works, our youth are the ones who forge ahead and invent those new technologies.
    Many times, they are pushed on by an older visionary. That's the great thing about academia.

    So far, we all agree that the battery is the single-point failure of electric cars. But a successful technology is all about its' adaptation to a specific scenario.

    Case and Point: Pepsico.

    They have a fleet of 30 all-electric delivery trucks. They also have built their own charging stations, placing them at strategic points, so that their trucks can recharge.
    They're getting about 80 miles per charge, which is more than enough for local deliveries.

    Source: http://www.pepsico.com/live/story/frito-lay-expands-electric-truck-fleet092420131157

    As you can see, this is from 2013. I see these trucks on the streets of Brooklyn, NY, where I live. ;)

    If you have the courage and enough money, you can do anything.
     
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